Universe - Life - Purpose - Existence?

[Gordon Gekko]

Quote from aphexcoil:

The evolution / creation debate is getting old. Anyone can look at the skeleton of an ape and a skeleton of a human and correlate some similarities. In fact, they're damn near identical. They've got a brain and we've got a brain. They have two eyes and so do we. So I'm supposed to die and go to heaven while an ape dies and just disappears? If I have a soul, they have to have a soul. If you think humans are special, you're deluding yourself.

That being said, then we could go right down the chain and get to mice and assume they must also have a soul. They've got the same organs we do. A very small skeleton, but again, there are similarities. That is indisputable.

aph! i'm glad you agree here! however, it is your religious beliefs that are screwing everything up for you. who says death is different for an ape and a human?! not me! i say they're exactly the same! i will even say my death is the same as a worm's!

as for souls, i've already said i don't believe in souls. imo, who we are is the product of our brains being active. when our brain do not function, who we are doesn't exist. right now we are lightbulbs with power going to them, when power doesn't go to us (our brains) any more, the light goes out. that is our death. it's your bible that tells you that something has to happen after that.

so in summary, death for all living things is the same. as far as souls, show me what one is before you go asking if mice have them, too. see, your religious beliefs are nothing but extra pieces to a puzzle. you're trying to fit them in, but you just can't find a place for them. get rid of them, they're just not needed.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

Quote from aphexcoil:

Why are some people so against cloning? I think it is because it strikes a subconscious realization that there may be no soul. It is the fear that "if two people are exactly the same, how do you account for the whole soul thing?" Well, mother nature has been cloning for years -- its called IDENTICAL TWINS. Is there a law against that?

We feel this overwhelming need to be special because of our intelligence. Or, perhaps it is ego? In any event, we're reduced to debating "science / religion" and forcing positions such as, "your faith is illogical" or "your science cannot define god." It is a huge circle where the arguments just rotate in a never-ending ferris wheel. Yet, I am still left with questions that cannot be answered.

aph, so many of the issues you have arise because of your own acceptance of religion! i don't have some of the issues that you have!

i'm all for genetic engineering. it's the religious people that usually have the most problems with it. you mention souls again..i have no trouble accepting soulds don't exist! i have no need to feel special! i accept i am just a living animal on earth! think about the bible....suggesting the sun revolves around the earth and everything is here for us! that's not at all how things are! you'll feel so much better about how things are if you just accept reality!

 

[OPTIONAL777]

Quote from Gordon Gekko:


aph! i'm glad you agree here! however, it is your religious beliefs that are screwing everything up for you. who says death is different for an ape and a human?! not me! i say they're exactly the same! i will even say my death is the same as a worm's!

as for souls, i've already said i don't believe in souls. imo, who we are is the product of our brains being active. when our brain does not function, who we are doesn't exist. right now we are lightbulbs with power going to them, when power doesn't go to us (our brains) any more, the light goes out. that is our death. it's your bible that tells you that something has to happen after that.

so in summary, death for all living things is the same. as far as souls, show me what one is before you go asking if mice have them, too. see, your religious beliefs are nothing but extra pieces to a puzzle. you're trying to fit them in, but you just can't find a place for them. get rid of them, they're just not needed.

Gordon,

Where did you learn to construct an argument?

 

[Gordon Gekko]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:



Gordon,

Where did you learn to construct an argument?

lol..i don't need to get complicated. i am not trying to be ET's great debater. my beliefs are SIMPLE and ROCK SOLID! i'm not going to get into bickering over specific meanings of words or whatever. i've stated my beliefs on a wide range of topics. the logical, non-religious people see where i'm coming from without requiring me to get complicated.

plus, stu, axeman, and others are better at that anyway.

p.s. why would i bother trying to construct an argument in a way that would make you happy when your beliefs don't even require proof?! your beliefs don't even have a foundation to construct on! the playing field you want to play on is not level, so i'm not even going to try!

 

[They]

I knew the "Life is a product of brain function" theory? would surface eventually.

What part of SENTIENT and NON-SENTIENT do you not understand?

Can you locate the brain of tree for me please?

 

[OPTIONAL777]

Quote from Gordon Gekko:


lol..i don't need to get complicated. i am not trying to be ET's great debater. my beliefs are SIMPLE and ROCK SOLID! i'm not going to get into bickering over specific meanings of words or whatever. i've stated my beliefs on a wide range of topics. the logical, non-religious people see where i'm coming from without requiring me to get complicated.

plus, stu, axeman, and others are better at that anyway.

p.s. why would i bother trying to construct an argument in a way that would make you happy when your beliefs don't even require proof?! your beliefs don't even have a foundation to construct on! the playing field you want to play on is not level, so i'm not even going to try!

My beliefs don't have a foundation to construct on?

Pray tell.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

Quote from They:

I knew the "Life is a product of brain function" theory? would surface eventually.

What part of SENTIENT and NON-SENTIENT do you not understand?

Can you locate the brain of tree for me please?

specifically, what is your question to me?

it's obvious your brain is who you are. it certainly isn't located in my foot. where is the soul you people talk about?! when your body dies and your brain does not function, can you please tell me how you are still going to exist?!

i have previously stated my beliefs on this subject:
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=119328#post119328

 

[OPTIONAL777]

Quote from Gordon Gekko:


specifically, what is your question to me?

it's obvious your brain is who you are. it certainly isn't located in my foot. where is the soul you people talk about?! when your body dies and your brain does not function, can you please tell me how you are still going to exist?!

Gordon,

I often want to ask you "Are You Experienced.....Well, I am."

However, I can tell by your limited to the mundane world physical perceptions and conclusions, that you aren't.

Maybe you and Aphie can get together and do some blotter, turn on the black light, and listen to Jimi with headphones on......

You might just see things a bit differently then.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:

Gordon,

I often want to ask you "Are You Experienced.....Well, I am."

However, I can tell by your limited to the mundane world physical perceptions and conclusions, that you aren't.

Maybe you and Aphie can get together and do some blotter, turn on the black light, and listen to Jimi with headphones on......

You might just see things a bit differently then.

i'm experienced.

 

[aphexcoil]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:



Gordon,

I often want to ask you "Are You Experienced.....Well, I am."

However, I can tell by your limited to the mundane world physical perceptions and conclusions, that you aren't.

Maybe you and Aphie can get together and do some blotter, turn on the black light, and listen to Jimi with headphones on......

You might just see things a bit differently then.

I don't think hallucinogens are any basis to derive a religion from. The only thing you are doing is severely bending your perception of reality. How does getting into an "altered state of consciousness" provide a proof for something beyond reality? The only thing you are doing is changing your mind's ability to perceive reality -- you aren't changing reality itself. I've never seen the ability for someone that is high to levitate a CD in front of me.

You're a very judgmental person. I can perfectly understand why based on your highschool yearbook picture and prom date. Who are you to tell Gordon or myself that we haven't had such and such experiences? All you do is sit on your ass all day and lose money in the stock market and then spend your night photoshoping pictures -- and yet you have the balls to come on here and suggest I'm just talking shit on a bulletin board?