Ramblings on emotions and trading ...

[BCE]

Quote from ES335:

Couldn't agree more. I can't believe what passes as 'trading psychology' these days... what a crock of you know what. It seems like these trading 'coaches' spring up out of nowhere, with nothing but a bunch of tired cliches and empty words to offer traders who really either need a real trading plan or real consultation with real psychologists/practitioners.

There's only a handful of genuine/helpful trading psychology experts out there, Mark Douglas being the foremost of these, but my goodness, the charlatans are so bad it's almost laughable... But when you stop laughing, can't help but find it sad that these bozos are the same ones who will be the ones present at all the trading events out there, ready to take advantage of unsuspecting clients.

I'm not sure you guys read the article closely and thoroughly. I agree Mark Douglas is great. But Ari Kiev must have something going for him too as he's been hired by some of THE most successful hedge funds to work with their traders and HAS helped them. Would they hire and continue to employ a dud coach? I don't think so. Here's a thread I started on Ari. http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=76967&highlight=Kiev
BTW I first met Mark Douglas at a "trading convention" in Las Vegas about 6-7 years ago right before Trading in the Zone came out. He was the keynote speaker and his topic was basically an overview of the main ideas presented in this book. I was so impressed by his ideas I was in contact with his office who at first offered the book in a type of loose leaf format as it hadn't been printed yet.

 

[ES335]

Quote from BCE:

I'm not sure you guys read the article closely and thoroughly. I agree Mark Douglas is great. But Ari Kiev must have something going for him too as he's been hired by some of THE most successful hedge funds to work with their traders and HAS helped them. Would they hire and continue to employ a dud coach? I don't think so. Here's a thread I started on Ari. http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=76967&highlight=Kiev
BTW I first met Mark Douglas at a "trading convention" in Las Vegas about 6-7 years ago right before Trading in the Zone came out. He was the keynote speaker and his topic was basically an overview of the main ideas presented in this book. I was so impressed by his ideas I was in contact with his office who at first offered the book in a type of loose leaf format as it hadn't been printed yet.

BCE,

Both guys you mention above are legit, without a shadow of doubt. I'm not interested in naming the clowns, but you should be able to recognize them instantly, they've got 'phony' written on their foreheads and tend to associate with crap publications/software sold on late night infomercials.

 

[Lamont_C]

Quote from BCE:

I'm not sure you guys read the article closely and thoroughly. I agree Mark Douglas is great. But Ari Kiev must have something going for him too as he's been hired by some of THE most successful hedge funds to work with their traders and HAS helped them.

I was referring to the article posted. Neither Kiev nor Douglas are mentioned.

LC

 

[me1969]

Quote from Lamont_C:

Most traders, however, have no idea how the game is played. They don't know the rules. They don't know the participants, much less anything about their behavior. They haven't practiced. They have no edge, much less anything to hone. They guess. They gamble. They hope for the best.

Is it any wonder they're emotional?

LC

That ist the way most traders start. And quite a lot remain in this phase, loose their equity, and some start again and learn it the hard way. You need emotions to strive for becoming a profitable player in this game. You have to love it in order to get under the surface. For me trading is like looking in a mirror: I look alway at myself (not so nice all times And that is an important point: A lot of folk can not stand themselves, have a great challenge to accept themselves (who has it not sometime?). But in trading you have to grasp your personality (all shades) and work with it. You are completely reliable for what you do and in the long run for the results.

 

[trader28]

My accumulated ramblings:


You only need to master one setup to be a consistently profitable trader.
Screen time will allow you to master one setup.
After you have mastered one setup "own it "


The best traders can put on a trade without the slightest bit of hesitation or conflict,
and just as freely and without hesitation or conflict, admit it isn't working.
They can get out of the trade -- even with a loss --
and doing so doesn't cause the slightest bit of emotional discomfort.
In other words, the risks inherent in trading do not cause the best traders to lose their discipline, focus,
or sense of confidence.


You get paid for your discipline!

Trade for the art, not the money! flawless execution should be your focus!


When an investor interprets a state of arousal negatively as fear or stress,
performance is likely to be impaired.
A trader will tend to freeze. In contrast,
when a trader feels the surge of adrenaline but interprets this as excitement
or a state of greater alertness before placing a trade, then performance will tend to improve.

 

[slowdown]

v good post trader. y i think many good traders have 1 bread and butter setup tha they use constantly.

 

[me1969]

Quote from slowdown:

v good post trader. y i think many good traders have 1 bread and butter setup tha they use constantly.

I use just one but on different timeframes depending on the market (trending, bracketing). It feeds me.

 

[Kap]

Quote from Bitstream:

t it is a reoccurance that i feel, like a sort of 'illumination' before i enter a potentially big winner. when i feel nuttin' means that if am gonna take the trade it it's more likely to be a gamble. it's obvious it works like this; after seein' a setup u saw countless times before u get excited and your brain makes connections, endorphines and andrenline are realesed creatin' that stomach crunch. it's not anxiety, more like a realization accompained by a special feel.

yup, I'm with ya there .. often the most spectacular trades feel the WORST to put on.

 

[wanderer]

That's remarkable clarity of thought for someone who's just rambling...

Do you realise that you've revealed the Holy Grail ?

Quote from trader28:

My accumulated ramblings:

 

[gutsytrader]

Quote from kiwi_trader:


Take the buddhist approach - focus gently on the emotion not the thought cluster producing them and they will weaken.

ok, my heart beat is over 100, I'm feeling super stressed, and I have a knot in my stomach. I'm thinking about them but they seem to be kicking me right now. I want to feel relaxed and a disengaged observer. How do I get to the point where they weaken?