Oklahoma, I love this State.

[Wallet]

What I will never understand is why you and others suck on the dicks of some founding fathers as if they could foresee the future or could not be wrong on issues. The amendments were purposely called amendments to allow for changes. In ever other part of life do reasonable and logical people acknowledge that progress calls for changes and adjustments. Past practices are adjusted or done away with if they do not suit practicality in changing times anymore. Yet, here stand some die hards who believe everything some founding father said equals the word of God. Your country is one of the youngest in existence with very little experience and benefit of hindsight yet here you stand and behave as if every dot in the constitution or amendments is set in stone and can't be changed.

I am all for a democratic process where majorities have their way. The constitution is purposely designed and drafted to make it very hard to change but it can be changed and amended. If a majority in Oklahoma or elsewhere decides that open or concealed carry should be legal then I think I can respect and appreciate that. But in most of the open carry states there is no popular majority for that. Notwithstanding that fact, it's stupid to stand there and say that founding fathers said one thing and it can't be changed or adjusted. That is a redneck mindset that willfully plays dumb and pretends that something can't be changed when it can. Again if a popular majority decides it wants its way on issues then a democratic society should respect that. But don't tell anyone that anything the founding fathers said or wrote can't be changed.

You say if Oklahoma or elsewhere decides that open or concealed carry should be legal you can respect that..... well, that’s exactly what has happened, the majority (vast majority I might add) through their locally elected legislature voted that into law.

The Founding Fathers did foresee a time when when the Constitution might need change, thus the process for amending it was included. I wish people who are unhappy with current law and the way this nation was founded would try that instead of subverting it.

Btw, this Nation, a “United States”, was intentionality founded as a Republic and not a Democracy.

Thank You to our Founding Fathers.

 

[Bugenhagen]

Btw, this Nation, a “United States”, was intentionality founded as a Republic and not a Democracy.

Thank You to our Founding Fathers.

The US is both a republic and a democracy.

There are days when you realise you are completely wasting precious minutes of life as there is nothing solid one could hope to build on I'm off to make some plantation shutters now the bits have arrived from Amazon. Hands on work, good for the spirit.

 

[Cuddles]

The US is both a republic and a democracy.

There are days when you realise you are completely wasting precious minutes of life as there is nothing solid one could hope to build on I'm off to make some plantation shutters now the bits have arrived from Amazon. Hands on work, good for the spirit.

It's only a constitutional Republic until you get to the constitutional bit about "how to remove a sitting president". Then it becomes a lefty communist state.

 

[Wallet]

The US is both a republic and a democracy.

There are days when you realise you are completely wasting precious minutes of life as there is nothing solid one could hope to build on I'm off to make some plantation shutters now the bits have arrived from Amazon. Hands on work, good for the spirit.

A “representative democracy” is probably a better term. It is designed to give the Individual or a State some protection from the whims of a true popular vote.

I agree with the hands on work, finishing a new gutter project for mi casa.

 

[GRULSTMRNN]

Not true, those state laws and statutes do not enjoy a popular majority in many states where carry without permission is legal. You confuse popular majority with gerrymandered majority.

You say if Oklahoma or elsewhere decides that open or concealed carry should be legal you can respect that..... well, that’s exactly what has happened, the majority (vast majority I might add) through their locally elected legislature voted that into law.

The Founding Fathers did foresee a time when when the Constitution might need change, thus the process for amending it was included. I wish people who are unhappy with current law and the way this nation was founded would try that instead of subverting it.

Btw, this Nation, a “United States”, was intentionality founded as a Republic and not a Democracy.

Thank You to our Founding Fathers.

 

[Wallet]

Not true, those state laws and statutes do not enjoy a popular majority in many states where carry without permission is legal. You confuse popular majority with gerrymandered majority.

Citation please.

I call bullshit. Over the past few years we have seen many States adopt constitutional/open carry laws, this didn’t happen without the will and permission of the people residing there.

You can believe what ever you want, doesn’t change fact.

 

[LS1Z28]

What I will never understand is why you and others suck on the dicks of some founding fathers as if they could foresee the future or could not be wrong on issues. The amendments were purposely called amendments to allow for changes. In ever other part of life do reasonable and logical people acknowledge that progress calls for changes and adjustments. Past practices are adjusted or done away with if they do not suit practicality in changing times anymore. Yet, here stand some die hards who believe everything some founding father said equals the word of God. Your country is one of the youngest in existence with very little experience and benefit of hindsight yet here you stand and behave as if every dot in the constitution or amendments is set in stone and can't be changed.

I am all for a democratic process where majorities have their way. The constitution is purposely designed and drafted to make it very hard to change but it can be changed and amended. If a majority in Oklahoma or elsewhere decides that open or concealed carry should be legal then I think I can respect and appreciate that. But in most of the open carry states there is no popular majority for that. Notwithstanding that fact, it's stupid to stand there and say that founding fathers said one thing and it can't be changed or adjusted. That is a redneck mindset that willfully plays dumb and pretends that something can't be changed when it can. Again if a popular majority decides it wants its way on issues then a democratic society should respect that. But don't tell anyone that anything the founding fathers said or wrote can't be changed.

The constitution is a living & breathing document that can be amended at any time. But IMO, the original bill of rights is untouchable. Things like freedom of speech, freedom of religion, & the right to bear arms are immutable rights that should never be given up even if the majority of our population believe they should. I don't take everything the founding fathers said as gospel, but I definitely agree with them when it comes to the bill of rights.

The bill of rights is the foundation our country was built on. The freedoms & rights it guarantees allowed us to grow into the most powerful country in the world. The last thing we need to do is start changing it.

 

[vanzandt]

Just in time.... this happens today.

Officials: Mass Oklahoma inmate release is nation's largest

• By SEAN MURPHY Associated Press
• Oct 31, 2019 Updated Oct 31, 2019

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FILE - In this Tuesday, Aug. 27, 2019, file photo, Oklahoma Gov. Kevin Stitt speaks at the Cox Business Center in Tulsa, Okla. More than 400 Oklahoma prisoners are expected to be released on Monday, Nov. 4, 2019, in what state officials say will be the largest single-day discharge of inmates in the nation's history. The effort is being championed by the state's new Republican governor Stitt, who wants the state to lose its dubious ranking as the state with the highest incarceration rate in the country.

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — More than 400 Oklahoma inmates are expected to walk out of prison Monday in what state officials say is the largest single-day mass commutation in the nation's history.

The Oklahoma Pardon and Parole Board is expected to approve the commutations Friday and forward them to Gov. Kevin Stitt, a former CEO who has made it a priority for Oklahoma to lose its ranking as the state with the highest incarceration rate in the nation.

"The governor plans to review and take immediate action on the ... docket as soon as he receives the board's recommendations on Friday," said Stitt spokeswoman Baylee Lakey. "The governor applauds the Pardon and Parole Board's dedication to fulfill the will of the people through the ... docket, giving hundreds of non-violent, low-level offenders an opportunity at a second chance."

The commutations will be processed by prison officials over the weekend, setting them all up for release on Monday, said Steve Bickley, the new executive director of the Pardon and Parole Board.

Bickley says Monday's release is the most on a single day since former President Barack Obama commuted the drug sentences of 330 federal prisoners on his last day in office.

Oklahoma voters approved a state question in 2016 that made simple drug possession and low-level property crimes misdemeanors instead of felonies. A bill approved earlier this year and signed by Stitt applied those sentences retroactively and authorized an accelerated, single-stage commutation docket for those who qualify.

The agency initially identified nearly 800 inmates imprisoned for simple possession and another 98 convicted of low-level property offenses, but some had additional sentences to serve or were otherwise ineligible. Bickley said any inmate with a serious misconduct while incarcerated or those whose commutation was opposed by the local prosecutor or a victim were not included on Friday's docket.

"At the end of the process, we expect the amount to be discharged to be in excess of 400," Bickley said. "A lot of work has been done to make sure the spirit of the law is being implemented. We're not blanketly saying everybody should get out prison. We're trying to do what's right and fair."

Former Oklahoma House Speaker Kris Steele, who has spearheaded initiatives aimed at reducing the state's prison population, described the mass commutation as evidence of a historic shift in the way Oklahomans view crime and punishment.

"Historically, many in Oklahoma have seen incarceration and excessive sentences as politically expedient," Steele said. "We are breaking away from that model as we understand not only does it generally make a situation worse, but it also costs a fortune."

———

 

[Frederick Foresight]

But IMO, the original bill of rights is untouchable. Things like freedom of speech, freedom of religion, & the right to bear arms are immutable rights that should never be given up even if the majority of our population believe they should.

Perhaps I'm missing something here because I never studied your Constitution. But isn't the Second Amendment an...amendment?

 

[Tsing Tao]

It's only a constitutional Republic until you get to the constitutional bit about "how to remove a sitting president". Then it becomes a lefty communist state.

Not so at all. Totally OK with following the Constitution to remove a sitting President. That doesn't mean that I can't point out that there was no crime committed despite the opposing party trying to pretend there was.