If the Articles never go to the Senate then was the President really impeached?

[El OchoCinco]

Hey El NachoCulo, you need a new hobby. You are not too good at this thinking or reason thing.

"The Senate shall have the sole Power to try all Impeachments. When sitting for that Purpose, they shall be on Oath or Affirmation. When the President of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside: And no Person shall be convicted without the Concurrence of two thirds of the Members present."

Do you understand that?

The Senate shall have the sole Power to try all Impeachments.

Do you understand it yet?

ALL IMPEACHMENTS

What part of ALL IMPEACHMENTS do you not understand. The language is clear. The democrats are claiming the trial cannot begin UNTIL Pelosi delivers the articles. If he has been impeached, then Pelosi has NO Right to impede the trial. In fact, that sounds a lot like obstruction of justice.

There are only two possibilities either Trump has not yet been impeached, or Pelosi is abusing her power and usurping the power of the Senate. There are no other possibilities.

Thank you for proving my point.

Senate has the right to try all IMPEACHMENTS. That means the IMPEACHMENT is already done. An IMPEACHMENT is a formal charge.

So let's replace the language:

The Senate shall have the sole power to try all formal charges.

The formal charge was voted on by the House. Period. End of story.



So it does not say a charge is not a formal charge until the Senate tries it, it just says they are in charge of running the trial. But it does not negate the IMPEACHMENT or formal charge.

I am reading the Constitution directly. Unless you can quote where it says the charge must be delivered same day or is invalid unless delivered immediately, he was IMPEACHED.

 

[El OchoCinco]

What I think will happen is that Mitch will set a trial date and force her to send The Articles. If she doesn't, The Senate, while Mitch is in control, will move on and never accept them as legitimate.

I agree, she cannot hold them indefinitely or set the terms for handing them over. Her Constitutional role is finished and she has no right to hold them as leverage to strike a deal.

It is up to the Senate Democrats to take over if they feel there might not be a "fair" trial but the House is finished with their role in the process and no formal handing over need take place. The Articles are publicly passed on by the House and published like any other law or act of Congress and Senate has the obligation to set the date and proceed. When Congress votes on a law, we don't wait for them to hand it over, it is effective by law.

Same in criminal law, once the grand jury indicts, they are done and leave and it is up to the DA to take over unconditionally.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Thank you for proving my point.

Senate has the right to try all IMPEACHMENTS. That means the IMPEACHMENT is already done. An IMPEACHMENT is a formal charge.

So let's replace the language:

The Senate shall have the sole power to try all formal charges.

The formal charge was voted on by the House. Period. End of story.



So it does not say a charge is not a formal charge until the Senate tries it, it just says they are in charge of running the trial. But it does not negate the IMPEACHMENT or formal charge.

I am reading the Constitution directly. Unless you can quote where it says the charge must be delivered same day or is invalid unless delivered immediately, he was IMPEACHED.

Until The Articles arrive in The Senate, their is no impeachment.

 

[vanzandt]

Until The Articles arrive in The Senate, their is no impeachment.

Oh god, here we go.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

I agree, she cannot hold them indefinitely or set the terms for handing them over. Her Constitutional role is finished and she has no right to hold them as leverage to strike a deal.

It is up to the Senate Democrats to take over if they feel there might not be a "fair" trial but the House is finished with their role in the process and no formal handing over need take place. The Articles are publicly passed on by the House and published like any other law or act of Congress and Senate has the obligation to set the date and proceed. When Congress votes on a law, we don't wait for them to hand it over, it is effective by law.

Same in criminal law, once the grand jury indicts, they are done and leave and it is up to the DA to take over unconditionally.

We do wait though for Congreff to pass bills to The President.

 

[TreeFrogTrader]

What I think will happen is that Mitch will set a trial date and force her to send The Articles. If she doesn't, The Senate, while Mitch is in control, will move on and never accept them as legitimate.

In fairness to Mitch, he does need to block out a time from the Senate agenda to take care of the trial. I think he did that and now Pelosi is telling him it could be never or could be whenever she decides. You can't run a railroad that way, even if you took all the politics out of it.

Not forget that these dems are supposed to be the ones that you elect to put an end to all the chaos and drama and uncertainty. Yeah, right. The whole country is downstream from Pelosi's moodswings. The reality is that the polls for impeachment were strong in their favor but they dicked around for so long that the polls went against them right when they wanted to pull the trigger so they got cold feet. Sure, just keep dicking around and see if that helps.

 

[vanzandt]

In fairness to Mitch, he does need to block out a time from the Senate agenda to take care of the trial. I think he did that and now Pelosi is telling him it could be never or could be whenever she decides. You can't run a railroad that way, even if you took all the politics out of it.

Not forget that these dems are supposed to be the ones that you elect to put an end to all the chaos and drama and uncertainty. Yeah, right. The whole country is downstream from Pelosi's moodswings. The reality is that the polls for impeachment were strong in their favor but they dicked around for so long that the polls went against them right when they wanted to pull the trigger so they got cold feet. Sure, just keep dicking around and see if that helps.

I don't understand to what advantage it is to Pelosi here. Why sit on it? What's she gaining by doing that?

 

[Buy1Sell2]

I don't understand to what advantage it is to Pelosi here. Why sit on it? What's she gaining by doing that?

I believe she wants to be able to claim, for an extended time, that Trump is under impeachment and try to render him powerless to nominate justices, especially to The Supreme Court. Ruth is very sick.

 

[DTB2]

I believe she wants to be able to claim, for an extended time, that Trump is under impeachment and try to render him powerless to nominate justices, especially to The Supreme Court. Ruth is very sick.

Not a winnable strategy

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Coach makes some good points here, but just off on that one item about impeachment being official without The Articles arriving in The Senate in some manner.