Germany must be forced out of the Euro Monetary Union.

[sheda]

Oh, your on another one of your ego trips and you think comments like that make people feel bad about a country :lol:

 

[piezoe]

You seriously believe France will turn its back on Germany? A much more important portion of European life is politics than economics. That is what most Brits or Americans do not understand. There will be no European union without both France and Germany in it.

I have high regard for your opinion, as you have a more reliable read on european opinion. I have never been very sure about France. I probably over stated my case when I suggested that France could, or would, join in. They do favor, I think, the eurobond, but whether that belief is strong enough to leave the present EU I doubt. If they did threaten to leave and join italy, spain, portugal and greece, unless Germany agrees to the eurobond, I think you would have to agree that that would put tremendous pressure on Germany to agree to the eurobond.

___________
I was in France in May. What A lovely country! I have spent a great deal of time in Austria, and less, but always enjoyable, in Germany. I love all of these countries, and only wish them the very best.

 

[piezoe]

that is total crap: Germany has spearheaded efforts for Greek borrow rates to be lower even at the height of the last bailout crisis than going rates for France, Spain or Italy. Yes, borrow rates for Greece were set lower than the yield on Italian on the runs. So, with all due respect your comment is entirely untrue.

Can you document this. Is it real or just talk? This doesn't make sense to me. How could rates for Greece be lower than rates for Italian or Spanish bonds be justified? I would think Spain and Italy would have something to say about that! The only way I see Greek borrowing rates coming down, and being justified, other than through charity, is via the eurobond. And there is no eurobond!

 

[piezoe]

Can't argue with any of this, except your implied solution. I know you think Greece should spend it's way out of the funk it's currently in, but the one thing that I've always agreed with volpunter on is that the Greeks are in this situation because of the reckless spending, not in spite of it.

Greeks need serious reforms, or else they need their own currency to print and inflate away all the debt.

They have introduced serious reform. Whether it is enough I don't know. I am quite certain that locking them into severe austerity will perpetuate their recession.

 

[piezoe]

Keynesian economics has nothing in common with science and the outside world. More similar to the caloric theory. Simply no axiomatic.

This is somewhat true and that is why it is such an enigma. And therein also lies Keynes brilliance.

The macroeconomic experience in favor of Keynesian economics as a way forward out of recession has now achieved such a record of success that all forward looking Central Banks around the world seek to emulate it. It has been proven by the rise of the Third Reich, the final years of the great depression, and endless small and large recessions in the U.S... What remains to be seen is whether there are economies to which it is not applicable -- Japan perhaps.

 

[Tsing Tao]

They have introduced serious reform. Whether it is enough I don't know. I am quite certain that locking them into severe austerity will perpetuate their recession.

Introduced does not mean "will be executed on".

 

[zdreg]

That's kinda the whole point of the argument. The significant drop in the Euro would be just what the doctor ordered for the remaining countries.

since when does devaluation lead to prosperity? the euro has been weak and these latin losers + greece still can't export competively.

just remember, your currency can't go down unless mine goes up, and I don't like it when mine goes up

why? do you think you are so clever to make money of devaluation and other people's misery when they cannot afford to buy imported goods?

 

[Tsing Tao]

since when does devaluation lead to prosperity? the euro has been weak and these latin losers + greece still can't export competively.

It doesn't. But one positive is that it can lead to a stronger export growth. The Euro may have been weak lately from a historical perspective, but it is no where near as weak as the drachma would be (or has been).

 

[zdreg]

But one positive is that it can lead to a stronger export growth.

it doesn't help. devaluations are offset by structural issues excessive regulations, pension and salary obligations to the public sector and corruption. e.g. Zimbabwe, Argentina etc.when populism rules devaluations are of no help.

 

[Vincent S. Ashmore]

There is a hideous restriction of national sovereignty imposed by the troika of lenders upon Greek ministers who are denied access to departments of their ministries pivotal in implementing innovative policies. When sovereignty loss, due to unsustainable official debt, yields suboptimal policies in already stressed nations, one knows that there is something rotten in the euro's kingdom.