ES/NQ Trading - looking for solutions

[Robert Morse]

Stop trading until May, and try with the micro index instruments.

I have to disagree. Micro futures at $5/point will be more expensive per notional $ to trade. He was trading 4 ES futures and now you want him to drop to less 2.5% of that. The Micro futures will be good investors with smaller accounts but horrible for day traders.

 

[NQurious]

try with the micro index instruments

Do you think there will be sufficient liquidity to make those things worthwhile for day trading? Seems all attempts to miniaturize futures beyond the e-mini's have not met with much participation, right?

 

[NQurious]

I have to disagree. Micro futures at $5/point will be more expensive per notional $ to trade. He was trading 4 ES futures and now you want him to drop to less 2.5% of that. The Micro futures will be good investors with smaller accounts but horrible for day traders.

I saw your post after I submitted this one of mine but that is exactly what I'm thinking. The mico's will be good for the investor who wants to make a longer term, days to weeks directional bet. But how many ticks profit will be needed just to cover transaction costs?

 

[syswizard]

I see a lot of red flags here. Go back and do some serious backtesting and if you must trade live, one lots only until you know what you're doing.

Omigosh, I'd love to do that...but with the 3 indicators, this is a VISUAL system. That's very important to understand. Ii would be quite complex to establish a backtesting methodology for this.

 

[Robert Morse]

I saw your post after I submitted this one of mine but that is exactly what I'm thinking. The mico's will be good for the investor who wants to make a longer term, days to weeks directional bet. But how many ticks profit will be needed just to cover transaction costs?

I've traded the smaller WTI futures. The side that order flow is directed at is always one tick higher or lower than the full contract and that is 50% of the full one. Little to no public orders and MM locking in a tick.

 

[syswizard]

I saw your post after I submitted this one of mine but that is exactly what I'm thinking. The mico's will be good for the investor who wants to make a longer term, days to weeks directional bet. But how many ticks profit will be needed just to cover transaction costs?

Look, the micro futures are not going to work...the returns are puny....I may as well go back to programming....which I don't want to do.
I am a hybrid trader, part scalper (1-2 points) and part day swing trader trying to pick up some trends for 4-10 points.

 

[NQurious]

Look, the micro futures are not going to work

I was not the one suggesting they would. I was the suggesting they wouldn't. If you read the market like you read ET that might be your problem lol ... whatever the issue, hope it works out for you.

 

[schweiz]

Calculating...$1000 per S&P point. So on Friday I did 4 points...so that would be $4000 per day.
Wow, that's a great income !

It works the same in losing positions, you just have to add the minus sign.
Wow, that's a great loss !

 

[Carlw]

Started about 3 months ago and what a learning experience.
Solving the hardware, software, data feed, broker problems were EASY.
First 2 months were a disaster with a 25-30% win rate.
Obviously my entries sucked. Every time I entered I trade, I was immediately down.....soon to be stopped out. I was always buying into resistance and selling into strength. The other big problem that I finally solved was revenge trading.....where after a loss, I would immediately go in the other direction only to be stopped out....again due to choppy conditions.
Well, I got much better and now I'm at 50-60% win rate. I maintain rigorous stops and never lose a lot.
However, there are still many issues I need to resolve: Any helpful comments greatly appreciated....

1) determining bet size...how many contracts to place in the trade
Right now I'm constantly trading 4 ES and 3 NQ....that's huge (for me)....and very risky.
Should I use a volatility indicator for this ? Which one ? I know for 1 thing, the first hour is brutal and I've got to trade with less size. Later in the day, I can increase size.

2) staying in profitable trades longer or until my indicators say to get out
This is a huge problem with many traders. I constantly get out too early...it's killing me.
However, I hate trailing stops....in the volatile futures markets, they take you out of the trade only to continue in your intended direction....which REALLY SUCKS.

3) Flatting trades when they don't go right.
THIS IS HUGE....I just let them take-out my stop most of the time for a big loss.
I need to focus while in the trade and if the action is poor....JUST GET THE F*CK OUT.
Sometimes this is not possible....today I lost $400 in one NQ trade in 5 Seconds....incredible.

Trading 4 S&P Mini's and 3 Dak's would require a cash account of around 100K and from the statements you have made it is very clear to any real trader your playing with a demo account and my bets are your not around after your demo runs out.

 

[Carlw]

Answer 1)

If you know trading 4 ES and 3 NQ is huge (for you) and very risky, that's another way of saying that you can not manage that type of risk. That type of risk is too big for you. Worst, you're acknowledging its too big of a risk for you.

What's preventing you from trading 1 ES and 1 NQ until you can find answers to your problem and the solution then consistently work for you. Next, after it consistently works...go back to 4 ES and 3 NQ.

Simply, your risk management sucks and you know it and you openly acknowledge it. Stop being a knuckle head and lower your risk (reduce your position size) until you can figure things out in current market conditions.

You do not want to put yourself in a situation were you "feel like" you need to trade to make money for whatever reason because it will make you trade in poor market conditions that you're not prepare to trade in or do not want to trade.

Answer 2)

If you're using any kind of risk:reward or profit target...

As soon as you reach your goal, take the profit (exit the position) and do not then become "Sheriff Hindsight Analysis" via becoming frustrated if you had stayed longer you could have grabbed a bigger profit.

Simply, know your destination target before departure and don't bitch about it after you reach your goal. Stay focus and stay happy when you reach your profit targets...bank the profit and move on...don't dwell on that you could have gotten more. Those that dwell on profitable trades that had reach the goal that was designated...it sets them up for future trade problems (discipline problems).

Answer 3)

You're acknowledging you're letting the market take out your stops most of the time for big loss...

What's preventing you from tightning your stops ?

For example, if your stops are -3 points...use -1.5 points assuming you're accurate when you say they take out your stops most of the time. I define most of the time as a lot > 50% and not a little > 50%.

Strangely you said something odd...if you know the price action is poor...why do you need to focus on the trade ? You should condition yourself that if you know the price action poor...do not trade and/or lower your position size. If you can not do that...you must then recongize you have a serious discipline problem.

Remind yourself often (write it on the wall in front of you) that if you feel the ES/NQ are fast in their price movements...its too fast to be trading it and the speed of them may be due to increasing volatility. Volatility is an important issue if your trade method is not based upon volatility which also implies its not suitable to be applying in volatile market conditions.

wrbtrader

I trade 1 ES period. Institutional traders generally block trade the mini's and this guy is no trader.