Discussion (or maybe not) between Good1 and studentofthemarkets

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Except for those occasions when, in its own words, Bible God deceives and lies. "I the LORD have deceived that prophet".

I just thought about this: God is SO HONEST, that even when He orchestrates other's dishonesty to accomplish His judgment, HE TELLS THEM WHAT HE IS GOING TO DO!!!!

Here's the passage. It is easier to understand in context, that this verse (vs 9) is a judgment for their wickedness....a giving them over to lies because they rejected the truth.

Ezekiel 14: 1-11
14 Some of the elders of Israel came to me and sat down in front of me. 2 Then the word of the Lord came to me: 3 “Son of man, these men have set up idols in their hearts and put wicked stumbling blocks before their faces. Should I let them inquire of me at all? 4 Therefore speak to them and tell them, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: When any of the Israelites set up idols in their hearts and put a wicked stumbling block before their faces and then go to a prophet, I the Lord will answer them myself in keeping with their great idolatry. 5 I will do this to recapture the hearts of the people of Israel, who have all deserted me for their idols.’​

6 “Therefore say to the people of Israel, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: Repent! Turn from your idols and renounce all your detestable practices!​

7 “‘When any of the Israelites or any foreigner residing in Israel separate themselves from me and set up idols in their hearts and put a wicked stumbling block before their faces and then go to a prophet to inquire of me, I the Lord will answer them myself. 8 I will set my face against them and make them an example and a byword. I will remove them from my people. Then you will know that I am the Lord.​

9 “‘And if the prophet is enticed to utter a prophecy, I the Lord have enticed that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand against him and destroy him from among my people Israel. 10 They will bear their guilt—the prophet will be as guilty as the one who consults him. 11 Then the people of Israel will no longer stray from me, nor will they defile themselves anymore with all their sins. They will be my people, and I will be their God, declares the Sovereign Lord.’”​
 
stop arguing / discussing among yourself.
Just answer this question.



Why the Bible doesn't talk about life/afterlife in the universe/galaxy?
This earth is just a tiny tiny dot in this infinite universe/galaxy.
So why focus on this tiny tiny dot?
 
God is SO HONEST, that even when He orchestrates other's dishonesty to accomplish His judgment, HE TELLS THEM WHAT HE IS GOING TO DO!!!!

Telling someone you are going to tell a lie, doesn't make you honest when you lie.
Even 5 year olds know that much.:confused:

I appreciate you're clutching at straws here desperately trying to defend the indefensible, but seriously, the hole you dug is already too big. You should really stop digging.
 
Telling someone you are going to tell a lie, doesn't make you honest when you lie.
Even 5 year olds know that much.:confused:

I appreciate you're clutching at straws here desperately trying to defend the indefensible, but seriously, the hole you dug is already too big. You should really stop digging.
I ALREADY showed you that the Bible says that it is impossible for God to lie, yet God does tell us that He will use the evil, and lying, that others do to accomplish His will....sometimes that is to let the wickedness be exposed to show how wickedness really is and sometimes it is to bring judgment.

You're blaming God, yet He does NOT do evil, but He does tell us that He will orchestrate evil people and evil spirits in the way they are permitted to do their evil deeds.

I already mentioned this, but this passage is an example of the Ezekiel 14:9 verse, yet God has clearly not lied. In His judgment, God sent an evil spirit who lied to FALSE prophets (those that already had rejected God's truths) who would prophecy lies to King Ahab....but look, God had already, many times, spoken to King Ahab, and he had rejected the true prophets.

This was NOT God lying but shows that He is in control of AND ALSO AGAINST all those that do evil.

God had already pronounced a death sentence upon Ahab (1 Kings 20:42, 21:19), but had given him opportunity to repent of his wickedness. With this final rejection of God’s counsel, God determined to carry out the death sentence. Since Ahab continued to prefer the lies of his false prophets over the truth given by God’s prophets, God chose to use the false prophets to carry out His plan. When God asked for volunteers to “entice Ahab into attacking Ramoth Gilead and going to his death there” (1 Kings 22:20), a spirit (fallen angel/demon) said he would be a lying spirit in the mouth of the prophets. God gave the spirit permission to proceed, and Ahab received the message he desired.

God chose to use a lying spirit because Ahab rejected God’s rebukes and warnings all through his life and the cup of God’s wrath was full. Since God is sovereign over all of creation, He is not restricted in what or whom He can use to accomplish His holy purposes. All of creation is under His authority, and He chooses to use people and spirits, both good and evil, to bring His divine plans to pass and bring glory to Himself. “He does as he pleases with the powers of heaven and the peoples of the earth. No one can hold back his hand or say to him: ‘What have you done?’" (Daniel 4:35). In the case of Ahab, God chose to using a lying spirit to accomplish His perfect and righteous plan (Psalm 18:30). The lying spirit will receive its punishment just as Ahab did, and those who repent of their sins will receive forgiveness just like Ahab could have. The real question is, “Will I respond to God’s warnings with faith and obedience, or will I reject His counsel and be rejected by Him?”
https://www.gotquestions.org/lying-spirit.html

 
stop arguing / discussing among yourself.
Just answer this question.



Why the Bible doesn't talk about life/afterlife in the universe/galaxy?
This earth is just a tiny tiny dot in this infinite universe/galaxy.
So why focus on this tiny tiny dot?

So here are some places in the Bible that say that there is life after death.....everlasting life and that God created all beings, both on this earth and that are in the universe. We tend to call other beings "angels" and "fallen angels" (for those that are in rebellion against their Creator.)

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16

15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For in Him all things were created, things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities. All things were created through Him and for Him.17He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. Colossians 1:15, 16

Psalm 148
1 Praise the Lord.

Praise the Lord from the heavens;
praise him in the heights above.
2 Praise him, all his angels;
praise him, all his heavenly hosts.
3 Praise him, sun and moon;
praise him, all you shining stars.
4 Praise him, you highest heavens
and you waters above the skies.

5 Let them praise the name of the Lord,
for at his command they were created


 
“My question goes to why you have chosen this particular collection, rather than those other collections/sources available? You are smarter than 1.8 billion Muslims? Have more faith than 16 million Mormons? Wiser than 144k Jehovahs witnesses”? 1. How many of the 1.8 Billion muslims were allowed to actively search the Koran and ancient scriptures to decide if what they believe is true or the writings of a tribal war loving raider? 2. Its well documented most Mormons and JWs are born in their religion and indoctrination starts as a baby. They were never given the chance to have a “Billy Graham moment” lest they get excommunicated or thrown out of their religions. The same with many of the Evangelicals I met, no ability to reason with doctrine or Scriptures. If the poster of the Thread has studied without bias apparently he is ahead the bulk of the worshippers you mentioned.
 
I ALREADY showed you that the Bible says that it is impossible for God to lie
Believer here.

May I ask you where the Bible says that?

Thanks.

https://www.openbible.info/topics/god_cannot_lie
100 Bible Verses about God Cannot Lie


Titus 1:2 ESV / 106 helpful votes
In hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies, promised before the ages began

Numbers 23:19 ESV / 98 helpful votes
God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?

Hebrews 6:18 ESV / 96 helpful votes
So that by two unchangeable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us.

1 Samuel 15:29 ESV / 47 helpful votes
And also the Glory of Israel will not lie or have regret, for he is not a man, that he should have regret.”

John 14:6 ESV / 28 helpful votes
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

2 Timothy 2:13 ESV / 26 helpful votes
If we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself.

John 8:44 ESV / 26 helpful votes
You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and has nothing to do with the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

James 1:13 ESV / 25 helpful votes
Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God,” for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one.

John 17:17 ESV / 23 helpful votes
Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.

2 Peter 2:1 ESV / 21 helpful votes
But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction.

Matthew 19:26 ESV / 18 helpful votes
But Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

Revelation 21:8 ESV / 16 helpful votes
But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

Romans 3:4 ESV / 15 helpful votes
By no means! Let God be true though every one were a liar, as it is written, “That you may be justified in your words, and prevail when you are judged.”

1 John 5:20 ESV / 14 helpful votes
And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.

John 17:3 ESV / 12 helpful votes
And this is eternal life, that they know you the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.

Malachi 3:6 ESV / 11 helpful votes
“For I the Lord do not change; therefore you, O children of Jacob, are not consumed.

Psalm 119:160 ESV / 11 helpful votes
The sum of your word is truth, and every one of your righteous rules endures forever.

Galatians 3:16 ESV / 10 helpful votes
Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ.

Romans 12:17 ESV / 10 helpful votes
Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all.

John 1:1 ESV / 10 helpful votes
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Proverbs 12:22 ESV / 10 helpful votes
Lying lips are an abomination to the Lord, but those who act faithfully are his delight.

Leviticus 19:11 ESV / 10 helpful votes
“You shall not steal; you shall not deal falsely; you shall not lie to one another.

Exodus 20:16 ESV / 10 helpful votes
“You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

Colossians 3:9 ESV / 9 helpful votes
Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices

John 3:16 ESV / 9 helpful votes
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

2 Timothy 3:16 ESV / 8 helpful votes
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,

Ephesians 4:25 ESV / 8 helpful votes
Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another.

Psalm 58:3 ESV / 8 helpful votes
The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray from birth, speaking lies.

2 Samuel 7:28 ESV / 8 helpful votes
And now, O Lord God, you are God, and your words are true, and you have promised this good thing to your servant.

Ephesians 2:8 ESV / 7 helpful votes
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,

Romans 6:23 ESV / 7 helpful votes
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 10:35 ESV / 7 helpful votes
If he called them gods to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be broken—

Proverbs 19:9 ESV / 7 helpful votes
A false witness will not go unpunished, and he who breathes out lies will perish.

Proverbs 14:5 ESV / 7 helpful votes
A faithful witness does not lie, but a false witness breathes out lies.

Deuteronomy 32:4 ESV / 7 helpful votes
“The Rock, his work is perfect, for all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness and without iniquity, just and upright is he.

1 John 3:20 ESV / 6 helpful votes
For whenever our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and he knows everything.

James 1:17 ESV / 6 helpful votes
Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

Titus 1:1-16 ESV / 6 helpful votes
Paul, a servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the sake of the faith of God's elect and their knowledge of the truth, which accords with godliness, in hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies, promised before the ages began and at the proper time manifested in his word through the preaching with which I have been entrusted by the command of God our Savior; To Titus, my true child in a common faith: Grace and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Savior. This is why I left you in Crete, so that you might put what remained into order, and appoint elders in every town as I directed you— ...

Ephesians 4:15 ESV / 6 helpful votes
Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ,

Acts 5:3 ESV / 6 helpful votes
But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back for yourself part of the proceeds of the land?

Isaiah 55:11 ESV / 6 helpful votes
So shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it.

Genesis 12:1-3 ESV / 6 helpful votes
Now the Lord said to Abram, “Go from your country and your kindred and your father's house to the land that I will show you. And I will make of you a great nation, and I will bless you and make your name great, so that you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and him who dishonors you I will curse, and in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”

Revelation 21:27 ESV / 5 helpful votes
But nothing unclean will ever enter it, nor anyone who does what is detestable or false, but only those who are written in the Lamb's book of life.

1 John 2:21 ESV / 5 helpful votes
I write to you, not because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and because no lie is of the truth.

Hebrews 11:6 ESV / 5 helpful votes
And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.

Hebrews 6:17-18 ESV / 5 helpful votes
So when God desired to show more convincingly to the heirs of the promise the unchangeable character of his purpose, he guaranteed it with an oath, so that by two unchangeable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us.

2 Timothy 3:16-17 ESV / 5 helpful votes
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.

1 Corinthians 10:13 ESV / 5 helpful votes
No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but with the temptation he will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it.

Romans 11:29 ESV / 5 helpful votes
For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

Romans 10:17 ESV / 5 helpful votes
So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.

Romans 10:13 ESV / 5 helpful votes
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Romans 1:22-23 ESV / 5 helpful votes
Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.

Matthew 24:35 ESV / 5 helpful votes
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away.

Proverbs 17:7 ESV / 5 helpful votes
Fine speech is not becoming to a fool; still less is false speech to a prince.

Psalm 119:163 ESV / 5 helpful votes
I hate and abhor falsehood, but I love your law.

Psalm 90:2 ESV / 5 helpful votes
Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever you had formed the earth and the world, from everlasting to everlasting you are God.

Numbers 23:18 ESV / 5 helpful votes
And Balaam took up his discourse and said, “Rise, Balak, and hear; give ear to me, O son of Zippor:

Exodus 32:1-35 ESV / 5 helpful votes
When the people saw that Moses delayed to come down from the mountain, the people gathered themselves together to Aaron and said to him, “Up, make us gods who shall go before us. As for this Moses, the man who brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we do not know what has become of him.” So Aaron said to them, “Take off the rings of gold that are in the ears of your wives, your sons, and your daughters, and bring them to me.” So all the people took off the rings of gold that were in their ears and brought them to Aaron. And he received the gold from their hand and fashioned it with a graving tool and made a golden calf. And they said, “These are your gods, O Israel, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt!” When Aaron saw this, he built an altar before it. And Aaron made proclamation and said, “Tomorrow shall be a feast to the Lord.” ...

Genesis 3:4 ESV / 5 helpful votes
But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not surely die.

Hebrews 13:8 ESV / 4 helpful votes
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

2 Timothy 1:9 ESV / 4 helpful votes
Who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began,

1 Timothy 4:2 ESV / 4 helpful votes
Through the insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared,

1 Timothy 2:4 ESV / 4 helpful votes
Who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Mark 1:15 ESV / 4 helpful votes
And saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”

Matthew 16:18 ESV / 4 helpful votes
And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Zephaniah 3:13 ESV / 4 helpful votes
Those who are left in Israel; they shall do no injustice and speak no lies, nor shall there be found in their mouth a deceitful tongue. For they shall graze and lie down, and none shall make them afraid.”

Jeremiah 31:3 ESV / 4 helpful votes
The Lord appeared to him from far away. I have loved you with an everlasting love; therefore I have continued my faithfulness to you.

Proverbs 12:19 ESV / 4 helpful votes
Truthful lips endure forever, but a lying tongue is but for a moment.

Proverbs 6:16-19 ESV / 4 helpful votes
There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

Psalm 119:89 ESV / 4 helpful votes
Forever, O Lord, your word is firmly fixed in the heavens.

Psalm 89:34 ESV / 4 helpful votes
I will not violate my covenant or alter the word that went forth from my lips.

Hebrews 6:4-6 ESV / 3 helpful votes
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.

1 Timothy 1:10 ESV / 3 helpful votes
The sexually immoral, men who practice homosexuality, enslavers, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound doctrine,

Colossians 3:9-10 ESV / 3 helpful votes
Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.

Romans 16:18 ESV / 3 helpful votes
For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive.

Romans 1:2 ESV / 3 helpful votes
Which he promised beforehand through his prophets in the holy Scriptures,

Luke 21:33 ESV / 3 helpful votes
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away.

Proverbs 19:5 ESV / 3 helpful votes
A false witness will not go unpunished, and he who breathes out lies will not escape.

Proverbs 14:25 ESV / 3 helpful votes
A truthful witness saves lives, but one who breathes out lies is deceitful.

Proverbs 13:5 ESV / 3 helpful votes
The righteous hates falsehood, but the wicked brings shame and disgrace.

Psalm 33:4 ESV / 3 helpful votes
For the word of the Lord is upright, and all his work is done in faithfulness.

Revelation 21:3 ESV / 2 helpful votes
And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God.

Revelation 12:9 ESV / 2 helpful votes
And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world—he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

Revelation 1:1-20 ESV / 2 helpful votes
The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, who bore witness to the word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear, and who keep what is written in it, for the time is near. John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace from him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven spirits who are before his throne, and from Jesus Christ the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of kings on earth. To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood ...

1 John 4:16 ESV / 2 helpful votes
So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.

1 John 1:9 ESV / 2 helpful votes
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

1 John 1:8 ESV / 2 helpful votes
If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

James 1:22 ESV / 2 helpful votes
But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.

1 Timothy 6:17-21 ESV / 2 helpful votes
As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life. O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge,” for by professing it some have swerved from the faith. Grace be with you.

2 Thessalonians 2:11 ESV / 2 helpful votes
Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false,

2 Corinthians 4:4 ESV / 2 helpful votes
In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

2 Corinthians 4:2 ESV / 2 helpful votes
But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God's word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone's conscience in the sight of God.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 ESV / 2 helpful votes
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Romans 10:2 ESV / 2 helpful votes
For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge.

Romans 8:28 ESV / 2 helpful votes
And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.

Romans 5:2 ESV / 2 helpful votes
Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Romans 3:10-12 ESV / 2 helpful votes
As it is written: “None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God. All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.”

Romans 1:29 ESV / 2 helpful votes
They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips,

Romans 1:25 ESV / 2 helpful votes
Because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

Romans 1:16 ESV / 2 helpful votes
For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
 
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