Whats going on with all these people ready to give up their rights?

[jem]

another moronic sock puppet lefty comes in with the drive by ad hom ... stupidity.
go ahead ... tell me where I was wrong on this thread.

you are incapable of making any points.

 

[FrankInLa]

Simple: don't run a business where you can't over years save enough to stay afloat for a few months. What a ridiculous notion. Do we need to bail out stupid business owners? What are we talking about? Someone running a business who can't make enough to put safety funds aside or does not believe they are needed should do something else. Simple as that. Show me a family run restaurant business that acted responsibly and will run out of resources in 3 or 4 months because the lock down lasts even longer and I will personally donate a significant enough sum to support their cause. I will tag the donation so you know it came from me (I always donate anonymously as matter of principle). Remind me and hold me to this in 3 or 4 months if you like or care. Those are the businesses we should support, nobody else. Let the rest sink, as soon as this is over new businesses that are better managed will emerge and hire millions of workers back. After all the American economy is unbreakable and fundamentally robust, correct?

We're not talking about the airline who squandered cash with stupid buybacks. We're talking about families that run local eateries and coffee shops and make razor thin margins and weren't able to put together rainy day funds, or don't have the ability to withstand a two to three month down time.

What insurance should they have had? Business interruption insurance is denying claims from pandemics - look it up. And she's driving an old Cherokee.

You're a little out of touch here.

 

[Hotcakes]

What are you talking about. I did not even use the term hospitalization a single time in your referenced post. Nor did I allude to it. Read again. You are completely missing the point.

Yes, you referred to numbers, infection rates, and inferred hospitalization rates via "crippled economy". See the numbers you posted below? See the assumptions that you used below to extrapolate those numbers?

"are you willing to risk 1/6-1/10 of the population to be at extremely high risk of death?"

^^^^^See the above??? Those are numbers. You posted. Those numbers are based on your personal assumptions. Your personal assumptions that you pulled out of your uneducated, ignorant ass, WITH NO PROOF. As I so demonstrated. So now you're backpeddling.

There is no 1/6th to 1/10th of America dying off. There are zero numbers that support that. If you have ANY EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT YOUR RIDICULOUSLY INFLATED CLAIM THEN PLEASE POST IT. there is none.

The death rate is calculated using the total amount of positive cases. And since the total number of positive cases is much higher then we know now, your numbers are flat out fucking wrong. But I see you don't understand fractions or percentages sooo the point is moot.

Sure, even if this was remotely true (which it is proven it is not) are you willing to risk 1/6-1/10 of the population to be at extremely high risk of death?

Nearly 54 Million Americans Have Pre-Existing Conditions That Would Make Them Uninsurable in the Individual Market without the ACA
(https://www.kff.org/health-reform/p...ble-in-the-individual-market-without-the-aca/)

Cardiovascular diseases affect nearly half of American adults, statistics show
(https://www.heart.org/en/news/2019/...early-half-of-american-adults-statistics-show)

Nearly 37 million Americans live with a chronic lung disease like asthma and COPD, which includes emphysema and chronic bronchitis. Through education and support programs for those living with a lung disease, their caregivers and those that love them, the American Lung Association is continually working to reduce the burden of living with a lung disease.
(https://www.lung.org/about-us/mission-impact-and-history/our-impact)

 

[jem]

My neighbor ran a restaurant supply company in multiple states serving many businesses. My son told me he said he had over one hundred employees and is now down to 50. he is paying them out of his life savings...

you think that was a mistake of a business?

the man is a bit of hero in my book.
nice guy.
good little league coach.
no idea he was willing to bankrupt himself to help others.

Simple: don't run a business where you can't over years save enough to stay afloat for a few months. What a ridiculous notion. Do we need to bail out stupid business owners? What are we talking about? Someone running a business who can't make enough to put safety funds aside or does not believe they are needed should do something else. Simple as that. Show me a family run restaurant business that acted responsibly and will run out of resources in 3 or 4 months because the lock down lasts even longer and I will personally donate a significant enough sum to support their cause. I will tag the donation so you know it came from me (I always donate anonymously as matter of principle). Remind me and hold me to this in 3 or 4 months if you like or care. Those are the businesses we should support, nobody else. Let the rest sink, as soon as this is over new businesses that are better managed will emerge and hire millions of workers back. After all the American economy is unbreakable and fundamentally robust, correct?

 

[FrankInLa]

An old Cherokee but ran 3 dojos? Heck, that did not seem to work out so well. So, can you explain to me then why we as tax payers should support your friend? Awesome conservative principle, privatize gains, socialize losses...

We're not talking about the airline who squandered cash with stupid buybacks. We're talking about families that run local eateries and coffee shops and make razor thin margins and weren't able to put together rainy day funds, or don't have the ability to withstand a two to three month down time.

What insurance should they have had? Business interruption insurance is denying claims from pandemics - look it up. And she's driving an old Cherokee.

You're a little out of touch here.

 

[FrankInLa]

Never talked about hospitalizations. You are willfully ignorant and put up lies. On ignore.

Yes, you referred to numbers, infection rates, and inferred hospitalization rates via "crippled economy". See the numbers you posted below? See the assumptions that you used below to extrapolate those numbers?



^^^^^See the above??? Those are numbers. You posted. Those numbers are based on your personal assumptions. Your personal assumptions that you pulled out of your uneducated, ignorant ass, WITH NO PROOF. As I so demonstrated. So now you're backpeddling.

There is no 1/6th to 1/10th of America dying off. There are zero numbers that support that. If you have ANY EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT YOUR RIDICULOUSLY INFLATED CLAIM THEN PLEASE POST IT. there is none.

The death rate is calculated using the total amount of positive cases. And since the total number of positive cases is much higher then we know now, your numbers are flat out fucking wrong. But I see you don't understand fractions or percentages sooo the point is moot.

 

[FrankInLa]

Definitely a hero in my book as well, if true.

My neighbor ran a restaurant supply company in multiple states serving many businesses. My son told me he said he had over one houndred employees and is now down to 50. he is paying them out of his life savings...

you think that was a mistake of a business?

the man is a bit of hero in my book.
nice guy.
good little league coach.
no idea he was willing to bankrupt himself to help others.

 

[CaptainObvious]

Shocking how people can be so polarized on such straight forward issue. Health and lives over money, that is how we evolved as species. Hence we should listen to the experts that better understand how we minimize deaths rather than listen to those who tell us how we minimize economic pain. There is no easy solution to this challenging times. But there are some crystal clear priorities we should abide by. How that priority list is reversed for some will forever be a conundrum to me.

Happy discussion all and pls stay safe and act responsibly.

It not that simple. It not just money, it's an entire economy, all of society impacted for years to come. Tens, probably hundreds of millions destroyed financially. There is no stimulus package large enough to back stop what's coming. And nobody is even planning for or addressing the social unrest which is sure to come. Think Ferguson and Baltimore riots on steroids. Hundreds of thousands on the streets rioting. You think people who have lost it all with zero prospects of getting it back are going to roll over and play dead? By the time that scenario plays out the virus body count will seem trivial and pretending that isn't a real possibility is the height of irresponsibly.

 

[FrankInLa]

Not about money but your second sentence starts being all about money? There is social unrest when people are unfairly treated. Ever seen social unrest because of a virus or earthquake or natural disaster? People take to the streets when being unfairly treated by others. The rest of your post is pure conjecture and guesswork.

There will be no social unrest if the government does its utmost best to minimize deaths and optimize treatment for those needed, rather than pushes to open the country for business by Easter. People sense when their government elect prioritizes money over lives.

It not that simple. It not just money, it's an entire economy, all of society impacted for years to come. Tens, probably hundreds of millions destroyed financially. There is no stimulus package large enough to back stop what's coming. And nobody is even planning for or addressing the social unrest which is sure to come. Think Ferguson and Baltimore riots on steroids. Hundreds of thousands on the streets rioting. You think people who have lost it all with zero prospects of getting it back are going to roll over and play dead? By the time that scenario plays out the virus body count will seem trivial and pretending that isn't a real possibility is the height of irresponsibly.

 

[El OchoCinco]

It not that simple. It not just money, it's an entire economy, all of society impacted for years to come. Tens, probably hundreds of millions destroyed financially. There is no stimulus package large enough to back stop what's coming. And nobody is even planning for or addressing the social unrest which is sure to come. Think Ferguson and Baltimore riots on steroids. Hundreds of thousands on the streets rioting. You think people who have lost it all with zero prospects of getting it back are going to roll over and play dead? By the time that scenario plays out the virus body count will seem trivial and pretending that isn't a real possibility is the height of irresponsibly.

But are you suggesting then we simply lift all stay at home orders and just let people go on about their normal lives and take our chances? I understand the argument about the effect this lockdown has and will have but the alternative to go back to normal by next week seems like negligence.