I understand your a liar and a troll and haven't really got a clue what your on about.
Have fun restarting things all night!
What is the average can a day trader manage and earn on wall street?
- Thread starter tonyzhou
- Start date
I understand your a liar and a troll and haven't really got a clue what your on about.
Have fun restarting things all night!
I've been a professional trader for about 10 years. A proprietary trader. If you don't know what that is I trade my own capital which is then leveraged by a firm and I pay a desk fee monthly for the use of their infrastructure.
So typical earnings.. The majority of people that walk through the door make zero and leave within 6 months.
If you survive your first year you can probably expect to earn £40k - £60k (I am based in London hence the £)
Of the people that made this much in the second year a third will probably fall by the wayside, a third will stay at the £40- 60k earnings range and a third will kick on to the £100k - £300k mark.
Of the people that get to this level you get probably a third that stop making money, a third stay at that level and a third push on again to the £500k plus level.
This is all based on 10 yrs as a self employed prop trader, other's may have different experiences. These figures are all take-home pay. You have to make a lot more to reach that level of take home. I pay around £2,000 a month for my desk which includes TT, Trading computers, Internet computers, IT support, News feeds etc. When you start off you are on a 50/50 split with your firm so to take home £40k you actually have to make 80k on top of desk fees. You go up the profit splits depending how much of the profits you keep in your account. Or profit target hits (depending on what firm you are at)
So typical earnings.. The majority of people that walk through the door make zero and leave within 6 months.
If you survive your first year you can probably expect to earn £40k - £60k (I am based in London hence the £)
Of the people that made this much in the second year a third will probably fall by the wayside, a third will stay at the £40- 60k earnings range and a third will kick on to the £100k - £300k mark.
Of the people that get to this level you get probably a third that stop making money, a third stay at that level and a third push on again to the £500k plus level.
This is all based on 10 yrs as a self employed prop trader, other's may have different experiences. These figures are all take-home pay. You have to make a lot more to reach that level of take home. I pay around £2,000 a month for my desk which includes TT, Trading computers, Internet computers, IT support, News feeds etc. When you start off you are on a 50/50 split with your firm so to take home £40k you actually have to make 80k on top of desk fees. You go up the profit splits depending how much of the profits you keep in your account. Or profit target hits (depending on what firm you are at)
At your current level, if you dispense with the firm and go your own way and trade from your bedroom/shed/garage/whatever, how much less would you be making then ? -50%, -10% ? When you say take home, that means after tax ?
Im actually thinking about doing exactly that Joe. But to be honest a large part of my edge is derived from being on a trading floor, bouncing ideas, learning where people are making their money. Not to mention having the security if my computer dies on me I get a new one replaced immediately etc, it would be a bit of a leap of faith to go solo.
When I say take home that is before tax. The prop firm leaves it up to you to sort your own taxes out. You are self employed.
But there are perks to being self employed. Most traders have their own Ltd they pay their money into and pay a salary and dividends from that which has favourable tax benefits
When I say take home that is before tax. The prop firm leaves it up to you to sort your own taxes out. You are self employed.
But there are perks to being self employed. Most traders have their own Ltd they pay their money into and pay a salary and dividends from that which has favourable tax benefits
Yes, I see. I was just wondering if there was any advantage to the leverage the firm was offering after offsetting the costs.
Go it alone is possible for some people who can handle making their own modest infrastructure. I don't see much is needed other than a fast and reliable internet connection that is readily available these days.
Perhaps there is a commission advantage to trading under the firm's umbrella because they would be able to get better deals ?
Is the entry requirement to a prop firm just that you have to have a chunk of your own money ?
The leverage firms offer me is an advantage certainly for spread trading products that aren't fungible. And the occasional overnight trades I might take (90% is day trading) but margins are set by the exchange for the most part and day trading margins are pretty cheap even for retail people (if you can't afford $500 for an S&P then dont bother!).
The commission advantages are huge! But I am trying to adapt my trading to not be so commission reliant. As I get older it is more about personal satisfaction and life balance rather than most bucks made so the commission intensive trading can survive away from the prop firm but would only clear through a firm that can handle professional discounts. Theres no way I would pay retail rates.
I and every other prop trader I know always moan about the cost of desk fees and profit splits, but at the end of the day I feel it is important to have the things I pay for. So probably a bit of a false economy to save a grand a month in desk fees if it costs me 50k in earnings over the year.
As for entry requirements, if you are a trainee you shouldnt put money down (if they ask you to... leave!).As a self backed trader then yeah usually it is just a question of putting money down. The better prop firms will want to see that you know what you are doing as well. The markets aren't easy and the firms that have the best traders try and fill the floor with other good traders to get idea sharing etc.
The commission advantages are huge! But I am trying to adapt my trading to not be so commission reliant. As I get older it is more about personal satisfaction and life balance rather than most bucks made so the commission intensive trading can survive away from the prop firm but would only clear through a firm that can handle professional discounts. Theres no way I would pay retail rates.
I and every other prop trader I know always moan about the cost of desk fees and profit splits, but at the end of the day I feel it is important to have the things I pay for. So probably a bit of a false economy to save a grand a month in desk fees if it costs me 50k in earnings over the year.
As for entry requirements, if you are a trainee you shouldnt put money down (if they ask you to... leave!).As a self backed trader then yeah usually it is just a question of putting money down. The better prop firms will want to see that you know what you are doing as well. The markets aren't easy and the firms that have the best traders try and fill the floor with other good traders to get idea sharing etc.
I guess there's no easy way to know if going solo is feasible without trying.
Did you know how to trade before you entered the firm ? I don't imagine the firm can teach people how to make money. If they could, they'd get a bunch of kids cheaply and train them up.
Before I started trading I dabbled in forex and learned technical analysis. Virtually nothing that is actually useful to making real money.
I joined my first firm when I was about 22 and thought I knew it all (because I had been reading forums etc) I was a trainee and they kinda trained me up but I didn't make any money for about 6 months. Then I was fortunate enough to get taken under the wing of an experienced team and shown how to really trade. There have been lots of twists and turns since but that's what gave me my leg up.
Good firms can certainly teach people how to trade. There are ppl out there that can teach trading. Problem is there is also a lot of crap and ppl selling a dream with no substance.
The best firm I traded at focused solely on training ppl up. 80% of the traders were developed at that company. And yes they take their big slice. Trainees start on 40% and have to make like 200k to go up to 50%. But nobody is going to give it for free. I had a mixture of luck (getting in with the right people) and years of hard work. Its no walk in the park
I joined my first firm when I was about 22 and thought I knew it all (because I had been reading forums etc) I was a trainee and they kinda trained me up but I didn't make any money for about 6 months. Then I was fortunate enough to get taken under the wing of an experienced team and shown how to really trade. There have been lots of twists and turns since but that's what gave me my leg up.
Good firms can certainly teach people how to trade. There are ppl out there that can teach trading. Problem is there is also a lot of crap and ppl selling a dream with no substance.
The best firm I traded at focused solely on training ppl up. 80% of the traders were developed at that company. And yes they take their big slice. Trainees start on 40% and have to make like 200k to go up to 50%. But nobody is going to give it for free. I had a mixture of luck (getting in with the right people) and years of hard work. Its no walk in the park
