Trading Advice
- Thread starter enkidu007
- Start date
with 500K you should be able to sit down with some fund or broker ref and ask them for solid advice to produce your modest target result (no 'guarantee' of course, the power-that-be forbid them to say that word I am told) and make sure they understand 3 strikes and they are out. My guesstimations is by the time you get to the 10th guy you should be able to figure out what and how you want to do with your money.
Turok,
You are correct. The idea of this exercise is to give one an idea of the worst case of risk. Learning this on a small dollar amount should give a decent fear/respect for the market. Until this is achieved, the chance of this guy not losing his whole wad is probably zero.
Everybody else would probably tell the guy to learn on GE or some safe boring stock. The problem with that is the guy might think he knows something because everything is too slow to let the emotions kick in. Then he sizes up and kills himself.
At least with TASR, you will know immediately that you don't know much, and thus you will learn how to stop out, how to cash in before the profit disappears, and you might get 2 years worth of emotional experience in 2 months of trading something else.
In short, until you can make money on $3K, you shouldn't even be trying to do anything with the remainder. If you think about it, even TASR won't kill the guy with $3K. Remember, we are taking stock only ( no options ), no margin, and stops. Even if he totally screws up, the worst that happens is maybe he loses 50% of his $3K if TASR tanks overnight while he's holding it.
One more thing I should mention is DON'T TRY TO DAY TRADE EVERY SWING!!! This is why I say wait for a $5.00 drop. That keeps the guy from buying the thing every 10 minutes to scalp $1.00 and getting chopped up in the process. Using IB you should be able to enter the necessary orders to manage this process maybe at the open, and once an hour at worst from there on. This also helps the guy learn about OCA orders, STP orders, TRAIL orders, etc.
I can tell you from personal experience the best thing that ever happened to me was just plain going WILD with about $2K, trying every hair-brained idea I could think up (except futures), and getting blown away on many of them. Saved me probably tens of thousands of $$$ because I made mistakes on the small scale, not with major money. Learned a great deal about how emotions affect trades. Also started to notice patterns after the Nth time getting blown away on the same sucker pattern. Then, I learned about fading, etc.
So, this is a strategy for the guy's long term learning, not a way to make quick $$$. After all, if he makes quick $$$ without learning anything, it will probably be lost just as quickly later. This way, he might learn something and have a fighting chance.
PS. After the TASR experiment, then he should go to GE and prove he can actually make money in a disciplined manner.
You are correct. The idea of this exercise is to give one an idea of the worst case of risk. Learning this on a small dollar amount should give a decent fear/respect for the market. Until this is achieved, the chance of this guy not losing his whole wad is probably zero.
Everybody else would probably tell the guy to learn on GE or some safe boring stock. The problem with that is the guy might think he knows something because everything is too slow to let the emotions kick in. Then he sizes up and kills himself.
At least with TASR, you will know immediately that you don't know much, and thus you will learn how to stop out, how to cash in before the profit disappears, and you might get 2 years worth of emotional experience in 2 months of trading something else.
In short, until you can make money on $3K, you shouldn't even be trying to do anything with the remainder. If you think about it, even TASR won't kill the guy with $3K. Remember, we are taking stock only ( no options ), no margin, and stops. Even if he totally screws up, the worst that happens is maybe he loses 50% of his $3K if TASR tanks overnight while he's holding it.
One more thing I should mention is DON'T TRY TO DAY TRADE EVERY SWING!!! This is why I say wait for a $5.00 drop. That keeps the guy from buying the thing every 10 minutes to scalp $1.00 and getting chopped up in the process. Using IB you should be able to enter the necessary orders to manage this process maybe at the open, and once an hour at worst from there on. This also helps the guy learn about OCA orders, STP orders, TRAIL orders, etc.
I can tell you from personal experience the best thing that ever happened to me was just plain going WILD with about $2K, trying every hair-brained idea I could think up (except futures), and getting blown away on many of them. Saved me probably tens of thousands of $$$ because I made mistakes on the small scale, not with major money. Learned a great deal about how emotions affect trades. Also started to notice patterns after the Nth time getting blown away on the same sucker pattern. Then, I learned about fading, etc.
So, this is a strategy for the guy's long term learning, not a way to make quick $$$. After all, if he makes quick $$$ without learning anything, it will probably be lost just as quickly later. This way, he might learn something and have a fighting chance.
PS. After the TASR experiment, then he should go to GE and prove he can actually make money in a disciplined manner.
enhidu007,
1. I have included a pdf of some basic scalping techniques by a trader named Kevin Ho. Try them and see if any fit your risk levels.
File was too big. Do a google search on Kevin Ho or PM me and I'll e-mail it to you.
2. Get a real time trade simulator. Start executing trades.Do a search here on ET for more info.
3. Read as much as you can on the subject of trading. Become a student of the markets.
4. Join a Chat room and post your trades. Watch other traders execute their trades and learn. Do an ET search for more info.
5. DO NOT DAY TRADE your own money. It sounds as though you are not ready for live trading.
6. When you can turn a profit of $100-200/day on sim.....
7. Write a formal trading business plan. PM me if you need help.
8. Then begin trading your own capital. Small size.
Understand that the road to becoming a successful trader will likely take years (2-3) at least with no guarantees. There are many elements involved in successful speculation, and trade setups are just a component (maybe only 25%) of the equation. Trade Execution, Money Management, and Psychological components are equally important. And some would argue more important than setups.
Remember too, that market conditions continually change and the 1 or 2 setups you learn today will cease working at some time in the future. If you can understand this point now, it will save you alot of time, money and heartache.
In regards to some of the negative comments you received, Saying you wish to learn trading in a day or two is akin to asking a doctor to conduct a weekend seminar to teach you Brain Surgery. That's why so many in this board take offense.
Trading is a profession. With an enormous level of commitment. Treat is as such.
Good Luck!!
Best Regards,
Dave Scott
enkidu007: because we're all in the same zero sum boat (pitted against each other) and because most traders here (I have found) do NOT make a living trading but are rather scrounging around themselves trying to figure out how to win, I can pretty much guarantee you that you won't get enough understanding imparted by ET members for you to reach your goal.
here's another suggestion...
weigh your priorities. consider that you will continue losing unless you come to understand some key things.
you have a good (small cap) account size and your goals ($500 per day) are realistic and should be able to be reached.
Not with equities though, no.
I suggest you switch from equities to forex.
Once you do, then PM me because I can show you some basics that will help you lose less, and will set you on the right path to becoming a better (forex) trader, i.e. win more.
Until then, browse through this Trading forum - there is a thread here called Trading Rules started by one of the best forex traders in the world (later banned from ET). You may find it of some use.
Best regards,
trade off
It always amazes me how people don't get this last, very accurate point. Very well said. Although I once again have to disagree with the stated amount of time that it should take for a trader to become successful. The right method, learned from the right person, shouldn't have to take more than several weeks to trade successfully. Unless trading stocks is very different and more difficult than trading futures?
All the best,
Phil
$550K liquid and trading 50 share lots 
...all I can say is that my trading is riddled with holes like dimples in a game board. Every once in a while one of his loose marbles rolls across it and fills in a hole.
1st Year: Read Read Read. Study Study Study.
2nd Year: Papertrade as you continue to Read and continue to Study. Develop a trading plan w/specific entry and exit criteria. Determine what kind of stocks you'll trade and how you'll find them. (Technical scans? Fundamental criteria? A combination of both? Bottom up or top down? A small universe of stocks you'll follow and trade?) Develop a plan for money management and risk control.
3rd Year: Open a 10K account at IB. Trade in very small lots. Don't even think about making money. Concentrate instead on trading well. Control your risk. Study every trade you make. Continue to Read and Study.
When you're no longer losing money and have begun to actually make a profit, start increasing the size of your positions. Continue to Read and Study until you die or quit trading, whichever comes first.
Most will not have the patience for this, of course. But unless you're extremely naturally talented or brilliant or lucky, I agree w/those who've said it takes 2-3 yrs minimum.
A few good books, there are many others:
Secrets of Profiting in Bull and Bear Markets - Weinstein
Undeclared Secrets of the Stock Market - Williams
How to Buy - Mamis
When to Sell - Mamis
TA of the Financial Markets - Murphy
Harold
2nd Year: Papertrade as you continue to Read and continue to Study. Develop a trading plan w/specific entry and exit criteria. Determine what kind of stocks you'll trade and how you'll find them. (Technical scans? Fundamental criteria? A combination of both? Bottom up or top down? A small universe of stocks you'll follow and trade?) Develop a plan for money management and risk control.
3rd Year: Open a 10K account at IB. Trade in very small lots. Don't even think about making money. Concentrate instead on trading well. Control your risk. Study every trade you make. Continue to Read and Study.
When you're no longer losing money and have begun to actually make a profit, start increasing the size of your positions. Continue to Read and Study until you die or quit trading, whichever comes first.
Most will not have the patience for this, of course. But unless you're extremely naturally talented or brilliant or lucky, I agree w/those who've said it takes 2-3 yrs minimum.
A few good books, there are many others:
Secrets of Profiting in Bull and Bear Markets - Weinstein
Undeclared Secrets of the Stock Market - Williams
How to Buy - Mamis
When to Sell - Mamis
TA of the Financial Markets - Murphy
Harold