to the atheists on the board

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from Turok:

>I think you're still missing my point overall. You're
>not going to get advanced life in a 500 degree
>environment.

I guess I have no clue as to why you would make that statement(Ok, yes I do)

If we lived here in a 500 degree environment you would be saying "that is what I would expect from a creator" and would quickly follow that with "You're not going to get advanced life in a 75 degree environment".

Can't you see that if you are right and we are here as the result of an all powerful creator that you are now arguing against his ability to create live in any environment he darn well pleases?

JB

Now that's an interesting question...

I guess my response is that I suppose He could put all those creatures on Planet X in special force fields or something exotic outside of this universe as we know it, but otherwise I just don't see it...

What you're proposing is my understanding of the word "vitalism" and I'm not a true vitalist - at least not in the historical, traditional definition.

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

I know a lot of you guys are in CA. Just got this email:



Why are we still there?

Every day there are news reports about more deaths.
Every night on the TV are photos of more destruction.

Why are we still there?

We occupied the land, which we had to take by force, but it causes us nothing but trouble.

Why are we still there?

Their government is unstable, and they have no leadership.

Why are we still there?

Many of their people are uncivilized.

Why are we still there?

There are more than 1000 religious sects, which we don't understand.

Why are we still there?

We can't even secure the borders.

Why are we still there?

They are billions of dollars in debt and it will cost billions more to rebuild, which we can't afford.

Why are we still there?

It is becoming clear .......


We must abandon California!

 

[axeman]

LOL! No kidding!

This state is a fricken JOKE.

Just goes to show what people will put up with for
gorgeous year round weather.

*sigh*

peace

axeman

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:

I know a lot of you guys are in CA. Just got this email:



Why are we still there?

Every day there are news reports about more deaths.
Every night on the TV are photos of more destruction.

Why are we still there?

We occupied the land, which we had to take by force, but it causes us nothing but trouble.

Why are we still there?

Their government is unstable, and they have no leadership.

Why are we still there?

Many of their people are uncivilized.

Why are we still there?

There are more than 1000 religious sects, which we don't understand.

Why are we still there?

We can't even secure the borders.

Why are we still there?

They are billions of dollars in debt and it will cost billions more to rebuild, which we can't afford.

Why are we still there?

It is becoming clear .......


We must abandon California!

 

[Turok]

>but otherwise I just don't see it...

So let me get this straight...you're saying that he couldn't have chosen to have us live in other temperatures just fine? He couldn't wave his finger at Mars/Moon any other extreme environment) and allow us to survive there.

Have you not read the book of Daniel?

JB

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from axeman:

LOL! No kidding!

This state is a fricken JOKE.

Just goes to show what people will put up with for
gorgeous year round weather.

Yeah and there's that little issue of $250/sq. foot as well...

But, hey, I'd eat dog food for dinner if I could live close to the beach!

 

[axeman]

Shoe is now more aware of gods abilities than god himself

peace

axeman

Quote from Turok:

>but otherwise I just don't see it...

So let me get this straight...you're saying that he couldn't have chosen to have us live in other temperatures just fine? He couldn't wave his finger at Mars/Moon any other extreme environment) and allow us to survive there.

Have you not read the book of Daniel?

JB

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from Turok:

>but otherwise I just don't see it...

So let me get this straight...you're saying that he couldn't have chosen to have us live in other temperatures just fine? He couldn't wave his finger at Mars/Moon any other extreme environment) and allow us to survive there.

Have you not read the book of Daniel?

JB

But that's my point. God can, in my opinion of course, allow physical beings in this universe to live in extreme conditions but only if He intercedes supernaturally. I don't think this is how He operates on a day-to-day-basis.

Example: There are UFO reports where the cited object in question changes angles instantaneously. This contradicts known physical laws of the universe and therefore could not happen w/o supernatural intervention. This means that either the UFO citing was false or supernatural in origin (or the source should lay off the peyote buttons for a few weeks)...

 

[Turok]

>only if He intercedes supernaturally. I don't think
>this is how He operates on a day-to-day-basis.

So he doesn't want to speak to me as my friend on a daily basis. Nor answer my prayers (as he sees fit) nor lead/guide me etc.

These things of course (spread among all peoples) can only be possible with him "interceding supernaturally". (at last check I can't find my car keys let alone guide and communicate with millions of people at once).

At least now I understand why he is silent when it comes to me but I now have to really wonder about the stories being told by others.

JB

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from Turok:

>only if He intercedes supernaturally. I don't think
>this is how He operates on a day-to-day-basis.

So he doesn't want to speak to me as my friend on a daily basis. Nor answer my prayers (as he sees fit) nor lead/guide me etc.

These things of course (spread among all peoples) can only be possible with him "interceding supernaturally". (at last check I can't find my car keys let alone guide and communicate with millions of people at once).

At least now I understand why he is silent when it comes to me but I now have to really wonder about the stories being told by others.
JB

I wasn't trying to invalidate your experience. I just meant that imo He generally follows the physical and occasionally overrides with the supernatural as opposed to the other way around.

But of course you are right that if God can listen to simultaneous prayers, then that (and many other things) are constant supernatural/spiritual occurrences.

You brought up another issue I think. How does God hear simultaneous prayers? Again, if multidimensionality is true and there is a God, then God can easily hear simultaneous prayers.

But arguing about that is somewhat a moot point because if Someone created a universe this complex and life this complex, it's hard to imagine what else He could do...

I realize that's all speculative from your standpoint though...

 

[axeman]

Multidimensionality can easily explain parallel smelling
of the big crap I took yesterday too

Its all pie in the sky without a shred of evidence.

peace

axeman

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:

I wasn't trying to invalidate your experience. I just meant that imo He generally follows the physical and occasionally overrides with the supernatural as opposed to the other way around.

Also, this is all speculative of course, but again multidimensionality easily can easily explain hearing simultaeous prayers. That's not much of an issue in my mind at least...