the sooner we get away from BEEF

Are you saying that feeling tired doesn't matter? After I changed my diet, the fatigue went away. In addition, my cholesterol fell to half of what it was, my C-reactive protein levels dropped, and my doctor says that my kidney and liver function is now that of someone half my age. So, yes, how I feel does matter -- especially when it's backed up by solid scientific evidence.

Having a discussion about meat with a vegetarian is like having a discussion about God with Jerry Fallwell who selectively chooses scientific facts that support his view of the universe and selectively ignores all science that conflicts with his beliefs.

Science shows conclusively that you can eat meat and be healthy if you eliminate sugars, grains and processed foods from your diet. The head of the nutrition department at Yale said not too long ago that macaroni and cheese is worse for the human body than filet mignon.


Quote from killthesunshine:

Who cares how you "feel".

Everyone feels great till they don't, then they feel not so good :D
More...
 
Sorry, but all of these studies include reducing processed food intake and including exercise which resulted in weight loss. Virtually any rapid weight loss accompanied by exercise will reduce cholesterol by 10%. It's been proven again and again. None of these cholesterol studies provide for controls on factors such as exercise and stress reduction which also result in cholesterol reductions.

If you don't believe me, call Dr. Dean Ornish (the king of ultra low fat diets). Two years ago I called Dr. Ornish and I asked him how much of his results were caused by the low fat diet and how much was caused by the exercise, weight loss and stress reduction. He told me that there is no way to measure objectively because they were all included in the study. Please call his office and he'll tell you that himself. I asked him if he was a vegetarian. He said "no." He seems like a very nice honest guy and will be happy to discuss it with you. If Dean Ornish isn't a vegetarian, why should anybody be?

Quote from killthesunshine:

i guess your wrong afterall :D

J Am Coll Nutr. 1995 Oct;14(5):491-6.Links
Rapid reduction of serum cholesterol and blood
pressure by a twelve-day, very low fat, strictly
vegetarian diet.McDougall J, Litzau K, Haver E,
Saunders V, Spiller GA.
St. Helena Hospital, Deer Park, California 94576, USA.

OBJECTIVE: This study was conducted to demonstrate the
effectiveness of a strictly vegetarian, very low-fat
diet on cardiac risk factor modification. METHODS:
Five hundred men and women, participants in an
intensive 12-day live-in program, were studied. The
program focused on dietary modification, moderate
exercise, and stress management at a hospital-based
health-center. RESULTS: During this short time period,
cardiac risk factors improved: there was an average
reduction of total serum cholesterol of 11% (p <
0.001), of blood pressure of 6% (p < 0.001) and a
weight loss of 2.5 kg for men and 1 kg for women.
Serum triglycerides did not increase except for two
subgroups: females age > or = 65 years with serum
cholesterol < 6.5 mmol/L and for females 50 to 64
years with baseline serum cholesterol between 5.2-6.5
mmol/L. High-density lipoprotein cholesterol measured
on 66 subjects decreased by 19%. CONCLUSION: A strict,
very low-fat vegetarian diet free from all animal
products combined with lifestyle changes that include
exercise and weight loss is an effective way to lower
serum cholesterol and blood pressure.
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Quote from killthesunshine:

Who cares how you "feel".

Everyone feels great till they don't, then they feel not so good :D
More...

OMG.

I would bet you became a vegetarian because you didn't feel good eating meat. And now you say this. Wait until your diet gives you PEM and then see how you feel. :D
 
Would you mind listing some foods that helped you achieve better health?

Quote from tomdavis:

Once I stopped eating sugars, grains and processed foods I started to feel better. I wasn't really sick, but I was getting all the middle-aged symptoms (weight gain, fatigue, rising cholesterol, etc.) even though I was working out regularly. I changed my diet and now I feel twenty years younger.
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Good things to eat:
1. Protein: Meats (beef, chicken and fish) and eggs
2. Fresh fruits and vegetables (lots of salads - usually with olive oil and vinegar for dressing)
3. Nuts and seeds (take it easy on these because they have a lot of calories, but have some every day)
4. Dairy includes only plain yoghurt (I like Greek strained yoghurt the best -- "Fage" brand low fat (2%) is the best I've found because it tastes like sour cream and is great on a baked potato -- BTW, take it easy on potatoes because they're very starchy) I also have yoghurt with fruit or use it as a base for a creamy salad dressing.
5. Coffee, tea and water (keep fruit juices to a minimum - and no soft drinks) [I've eliminated all caffein from my diet now, but that's not necessary to get the benefits of this way of eating]
6. A small amount of sauces and condiments are okay, but keep it to a minimum.

Things you must AVOID:
1. Products made with added sugars (cookies, cakes, pies, fast food, soft drinks, etc.)
2. Grains (bread, pasta, etc.) [I ocasionally have a little whole grain pasta or brown rice, but not very often]
3. Avoid like the plague all processed and refined foods that you find in the supermarkets
4. No fried foods - ever

Make lean meats, fresh fruits and fresh vegetables 80-90% of your calories and you'll be off to a good start.

Making these changes was not easy. The first month was hell. The second month was heck. After that, it was easy. The only really tough time is at special occasions (e.g., my daughters' birthday parties where there was ice cream and cake put on the table in front me -- which I love. I admit that I took a taste.)

As diffilcult as these changes were, it was worth it for the positive changes in my health, especially the amazing increase in energy and stamina.


Quote from Fireplace:

Would you mind listing some foods that helped you achieve better health?
More...
 
Quote from tomdavis:

Good things to eat:
1. Protein: Meats (beef, chicken and fish) and eggs
2. Fresh fruits and vegetables (lots of salads - usually with olive oil and vinegar for dressing)
3. Nuts and seeds (take it easy on these because they have a lot of calories, but have some every day)
4. Dairy includes only plain yoghurt (I like Greek strained yoghurt the best -- "Fage" brand low fat (2%) is the best I've found because it tastes like sour cream and is great on a baked potato -- BTW, take it easy on potatoes because they're very starchy) I also have yoghurt with fruit or use it as a base for a creamy salad dressing.
5. Coffee, tea and water (keep fruit juices to a minimum - and no soft drinks) [I've eliminated all caffein from my diet now, but that's not necessary to get the benefits of this way of eating]
6. A small amount of sauces and condiments are okay, but keep it to a minimum.

Things you must AVOID:
1. Products made with added sugars (cookies, cakes, pies, fast food, soft drinks, etc.)
2. Grains (bread, pasta, etc.) [I ocasionally have a little whole grain pasta or brown rice, but not very often]
3. Avoid like the plague all processed and refined foods that you find in the supermarkets
4. No fried foods - ever

Make lean meats, fresh fruits and fresh vegetables 80-90% of your calories and you'll be off to a good start.

Making these changes was not easy. The first month was hell. The second month was heck. After that, it was easy. The only really tough time is at special occasions (e.g., my daughters' birthday parties where there was ice cream and cake put on the table in front me -- which I love. I admit that I took a taste.)

As diffilcult as these changes were, it was worth it for the positive changes in my health, especially the amazing increase in energy and stamina.
More...

Meat, eggs dairy full of BAD FAT! If must eat dairy onl;y FAT-FREE!

EAT LEAFY GREENS!! THEN EAT SOME MORE! :D

ps throw the olive oil away too;high bad fat no eat :D
 
why ask "Tom" what the heel does he know?

Consider at least opting for organic when buying these fruits and vegetables, as they’re considered the top 10 worst offenders for pesticides, according to the Environmental Working Group:

* Apples
* Celery
* Cherries
* Grapes (imported)
* Lettuce
* Nectarines
* Peaches
* Pears
* Strawberries
* Sweet bell peppers
 
My wife does most of the shopping and she opts for organic when possible. She thinks it's better, even though most of the studies show no real advantage to organic.

She started buying organic produce when our kids (now 9 and 12) were very young. That was about 7 years before I changed my diet.

To answer your question, we eat a lot of organic foods, but I'm not sure how much better they are for you, if at all.

Quote from Fireplace:

Tom, what is your take on organic vrs not when talking about fruits and vegetables?
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