The Moral Decline Of The Late Great United States

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from RCG Trader:

You mean the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?

Those rights?

Large segments of the population stood actively disenfranchised at the time of the declaration. Did the founders believe what they wrote, or not?

Yes, those rights. Every man has the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Of course they believed what they wrote.

The issue then came to the populace at the time to choose what race would receive the definition of "man". The populace, and the government choose poorly. These rights are inalienable. Given to every human being (or should be) regardless of race, nationality, color of skin, gender, sexual preference, etc.

But that is where it should stop. Having these rights does not mean people have the right for someone to treat them if they become ill and cannot afford it. It does not mean they have the right to food stamps or unemployment benefits if they lose their job, or worse yet - decide to not work. They do not have a right to keep on living if they decide to stop taking care of themselves, or stop trying to better themselves.

The rights of life, liberty and pursuit of happiness are rights of ownership. All men have the right to own these rights, but just like anything, they have to be seized. They are not born with, and they require payment to be given - in desire. Everyone has the right to eat food, for example, but they must work to acquire that food. They do not have the right to free food, because that free food comes from someone else's expense. When you take that food away from another, you infringe upon their rights.

That's the problem in the equation today.

 

[RCG Trader]

Quote from Mercor:

Blacks were not considered people, they were property. Just like unborn babies today. Being property is not good and property has no due process or rights.

The simple fact that blacks were property at the time of the declaration meant that it was a house built on sand. The very Christian principles it was ostensibly built upon guaranteed it's demise as originally written.

If America were truly a Christian nation, there would be no need for Amendments.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from RCG Trader:

Blacks are NOT moving back to Mississippi or Alabama. They are moving to Virginia, and North Carolina. And certain very blue enclaves in a sea of red.

Conservatives have always been the enemy, they will always be the enemy, all over this globe.

Conservatives may have been the perceived enemy, but Democrats are the real enemy to blacks. It remains up to Blacks whether to see and accept this, or not. If not, then they condemn themselves to a lifetime of poverty and insignificance.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from RCG Trader:

The simple fact that blacks were property at the time of the declaration meant that it was a house built on sand. The very Christian principles it was ostensibly built upon guaranteed it's demise as originally written.

If America were truly a Christian nation, there would be no need for Amendments.

Don't be dumb. The founding fathers recognized that they did not have the foresight to see everything they needed to, so they created a method in which the document could become a living one. Perhaps they understood that the political capital wasn't there for bringing blacks into the fold of what was deemed "man" in text. Who knows? Certainly not you or I. Maybe this was their way to see that it was addressed when their society was ready.

 

[RCG Trader]

Quote from Tsing Tao:

Yes, those rights. Every man has the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Of course they believed what they wrote.

The issue then came to the populace at the time to choose what race would receive the definition of "man". The populace, and the government choose poorly. These rights are inalienable. Given to every human being (or should be) regardless of race, nationality, color of skin, gender, sexual preference, etc.

But that is where it should stop. Having these rights does not mean people have the right for someone to treat them if they become ill and cannot afford it. It does not mean they have the right to food stamps or unemployment benefits if they lose their job, or worse yet - decide to not work. They do not have a right to keep on living if they decide to stop taking care of themselves, or stop trying to better themselves.

The rights of life, liberty and pursuit of happiness are rights of ownership. All men have the right to own these rights, but just like anything, they have to be seized. They are not born with, and they require payment to be given - in desire. Everyone has the right to eat food, for example, but they must work to acquire that food. They do not have the right to free food, because that free food comes from someone else's expense. When you take that food away from another, you infringe upon their rights.

That's the problem in the equation today.

The rest of that excellent post notwithstanding, if the founders believed what they wrote, I say again, no other Amendments to the Constitution would have been needed.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from RCG Trader:

The rest of that excellent post notwithstanding, if the founders believed what they wrote, I say again, no other Amendments to the Constitution would have been needed.

I addressed that in my next post.

 

[RCG Trader]

Quote from Tsing Tao:

Don't be dumb. The founding fathers recognized that they did not have the foresight to see everything they needed to, so they created a method in which the document could become a living one. Perhaps they understood that the political capital wasn't there for bringing blacks into the fold of what was deemed "man" in text. Who knows? Certainly not you or I. Maybe this was their way to see that it was addressed when their society was ready.

Actually, I think Thomas Jefferson said as much. Not sure. But one of the founders is attributed to that very concept. But that founder was defeated in the end. This led to the bloodiest war in American history, do this day.

All they needed to do was practice what was preached. Don't get me wrong, I love America, but I have no need to romanticize the past, either.

 

[RCG Trader]

Oh, and one more thing. I am not so myopic to think only of my ethnic group.

No minority could vote. Not women, not poor whites. Blacks have never been, alone, a significant portion of the population. The disenfranchisement was massive.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from RCG Trader:

Actually, I think Thomas Jefferson said as much. Not sure. But one of the founders is attributed to that very concept. But that founder was defeated in the end. This led to the bloodiest war in American history, do this day.

All they needed to do was practice what was preached. Don't get me wrong, I love America, but I have no need to romanticize the past, either.

It's not about romanticizing anything. It is unlikely the founders suspected a bloody war like the Civil War. But probably they knew that the creation of a Republic that was founded on equality of races was not going to fly when they needed to do it - and they needed to do it then and there against King George.

No country's history has been perfect. Whenever men are involved, imperfection is sown. But given the country's history, I think we can safely say that it is, or rather was, the greatest country the world has ever seen.

Would it have been nicer for freedom to have come earlier for your people? Absolutely. But there are still countries that, today, treat blacks worse off than whites - far worse than anything that goes on within these borders, including some in Africa itself.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from RCG Trader:

Oh, and one more thing. I am not so myopic to think only of my ethnic group.

No minority could vote. Not women, not poor whites. Blacks have never been, alone, a significant portion of the population. The disenfranchisement was massive.

I don't think it's unfair or myopic to refer to blacks as the main race in the struggle. They were. Many of the freedoms enjoyed today by minorities were paid for in the blood and tears of the African American.


And with that, I'm off to get some lunch.