The Irrational, Unshakable Faith of the Collusion Conspiracists

[piezoe]

@Slartibartfast . Serious question...no troll intended. What specific action do you think the Russian/trump team did to collude ? Did they rig voting machines ? Intimidate voters ? What is the holy grail you hope is uncovered by the investigation ? Anyone ? specifics only.

I have no doubt Russia meddled, trying to influence elections is as old as spycraft itself. But what did Trump actually do to assist the Russians ? Specifically !

You were asking Startibartfast, and he gave you the answer you were seeking, but I want to mention something else that may be of passing interest. And let me just say I can not give you a link because so far as I know Trump and those he has authorized are the only ones to lay eyes on his IRS tax returns. But I believe it is a real good bet that copies of those returns are in a file cabinet at the FBI. What we do know is that trump was the facilitator of copius money laundering by Russian and Russian related persons. There is a very extensive, publicly available, investigative literature in this regard. And it is available to you at your finger tips. If you do a google search, you'll turn up numerous well vetted documents and reports from reliable sources. I gave a link to one such report in this very thread.

My guess is that Trump is vulnerable not only on Obstruction of Justice, but also Money Laundering, and let's raise our voices and shout it altogether now: "TAX FRAUD." If a guy who lies with almost every sentence out of his mouth always filed truthful tax returns, then I work for a Conservative "Think" Tank, just like Futurecurrents believes.

 

[piezoe]

Clinton had entered into a memorandum of understanding as discussed-

wrong!

 

[TreeFrogTrader]

wrong!

Aright, a memorandum was created but Clinton was not a signatory even though her appointment and secretary of state and interactions with the Clinton foundation were the subject. Now that you have that aside out of the way, let's return to the point of the memorandum even coming up in discussion.

The original discussion was whether foundations are required to disclose donors. I said that, new York law and u.s. law aside, the foundation reporting was required based on a memorandum of understanding.

That is true or not true?

Thank you. Let's leave it there.

 

[Slartibartfast]

so just to be clear..The wet dream for the Left solely revolves around the Eric jr communications and any ramifications from such ? Nothing else ?

You asked as I understood, for collusion. I gave an example, there are others however you are not serious.

I am not "left" like you may believe. I want Trump stopped however that is due to my distaste for the tactics he is using and the consequences of his business style. However successful he is at short-circuiting Washington in the short term there is a high price to pay.

To me Donald Trump is in part like a European Gypsy/Tinker/Traveler. Many are good enough people and there are some who are scurrilous & shameless. They have evolved a defense from the law very different to a settled person who has a mortgage and fixed address.

The 'throw shapes', make smoke, become incoherent, dramatic, aggressive, defensive, passive all at the same time. They do this in an organised & practiced way, it is like how an octopus quirts ink. The skills are passed through generations.

A typical cop looks at a gypsy and thinks.. I need to get home and this guy is going to give me a migraine, the last one shit himself in my car... oh look is that a middle class guy with a cracked tail light?

Donald Trump has not been successful because of great talent but because he is a spectacular bullshitter who overloads civilised society. If he had been born poorer (no private military school) he would likely have been in jail and remained a small fry.

If we have more if him learning from his model... civilisation vanishes and as a naturally conservative thinker I don't like that. Even the Thunderdome had rules.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Aright, a memorandum was created but Clinton was not a signatory even though her appointment and secretary of state and interactions with the Clinton foundation were the subject. Now that you have that aside out of the way, let's return to the point of the memorandum even coming up in discussion.

The original discussion was whether foundations are required to disclose donors. I said that, new York law and u.s. law aside, the foundation reporting was required based on a memorandum of understanding.

That is true or not true?

Thank you. Let's leave it there.

You are literally to stupid to know how stupid you are. Lets leave it at that.

 

[sss12]

You were asking Startibartfast, and he gave you the answer you were seeking, but I want to mention something else that may be of passing interest. And let me just say I can not give you a link because so far as I know Trump and those he has authorized are the only ones to lay eyes on his IRS tax returns. But I believe it is a real good bet that copies of those returns are in a file cabinet at the FBI. What we do know is that trump was the facilitator of copius money laundering by Russian and Russian related persons. There is a very extensive, publicly available, investigative literature in this regard. And it is available to you at your finger tips. If you do a google search, you'll turn up numerous well vetted documents and reports from reliable sources. I gave a link to one such report in this very thread.

My guess is that Trump is vulnerable not only on Obstruction of Justice, but also Money Laundering, and let's raise our voices and shout it altogether now: "TAX FRAUD." If a guy who lies with almost every sentence out of his mouth always filed truthful tax returns, then I work for a Conservative "Think" Tank, just like Futurecurrents believes.

Here is my problem (I am far from the expert, but do know a little in this area)with the money laundering angle. People or entities launder to incorporated ill gotten gains into the normal monetary supply chain. The higher ups in Russia do not have that concern since they are not following western rules and governance in the first place. They have no reason to launder since they have no concern or need of appearing legit in western parlance.

and actually, I think your angle is the only other one I've heard other than the "eric jr" smoking gun. any others ??? what is the wet dream you are hoping to find with this investigation ??

I'm not saying there is not one, that is what the investigation is for, just asking what people are hoping for.

 

[sss12]

You asked as I understood, for collusion. I gave an example, there are others however you are not serious.

I am not "left" like you may believe. I want Trump stopped however that is due to my distaste for the tactics he is using and the consequences of his business style. However successful he is at short-circuiting Washington in the short term there is a high price to pay.

To me Donald Trump is in part like a European Gypsy/Tinker/Traveler. Many are good enough people and there are some who are scurrilous & shameless. They have evolved a defense from the law very different to a settled person who has a mortgage and fixed address.

The 'throw shapes', make smoke, become incoherent, dramatic, aggressive, defensive, passive all at the same time. They do this in an organised & practiced way, it is like how an octopus quirts ink. The skills are passed through generations.

A typical cop looks at a gypsy and thinks.. I need to get home and this guy is going to give me a migraine, the last one shit himself in my car... oh look is that a middle class guy with a cracked tail light?

Donald Trump has not been successful because of great talent but because he is a spectacular bullshitter who overloads civilised society. If he had been born poorer (no private military school) he would likely have been in jail and remained a small fry.

If we have more if him learning from his model... civilisation vanishes and as a naturally conservative thinker I don't like that. Even the Thunderdome had rules.

Unfortunately for you your "distaste" for the person is not enough to end an administration.
You are not alone in your view by any means, but those who do not like the current situation should be marshaling their forces for 2020 versus chasin' trump in circles for 4 yrs.

Since everyone here loves to speculate...here is mine... in 2 1/2 yrs Trump says "been there, done that" I'm going back to the private sector. Here is my man Mike Pence (Koch brothers financed). Dems "hoorah Trump is gone...we are running ...we are running... we are running ?? oh,no....we have done nothing in our party in 4 yrs. we still don't know why white women in Philly, Lansing and Dearborn voted for the evil Trump and not our girl Hil.
We have no one......Joe Biden answer your phone ?! Elizabeth W ?
GOP is back on track.

 

[TreeFrogTrader]

Since everyone here loves to speculate...here is mine... in 2 1/2 yrs Trump says "been there, done that" I'm going back to the private sector. Here is my man Mike Pence (Koch brothers financed). Dems "hoorah Trump is gone...we are running ...we are running... we are running ?? oh,no....we have done nothing in our party in 4 yrs. we still don't know why white women in Philly, Lansing and Dearborn voted for the evil Trump and not our girl Hil. We have no one......Joe Biden answer your phone ?! Elizabeth W ?
GOP is back on track.

Correct on all counts.

 

[piezoe]

Aright, a memorandum was created but Clinton was not a signatory even though her appointment and secretary of state and interactions with the Clinton foundation were the subject. Now that you have that aside out of the way, let's return to the point of the memorandum even coming up in discussion.

The original discussion was whether foundations are required to disclose donors. I said that, new York law and u.s. law aside, the foundation reporting was required based on a memorandum of understanding.

That is true or not true?

Thank you. Let's leave it there.

The Foundation agreed to some disclosure despite not being bound by Federal Law to disclose..
Under Federal law 501c3 filers are not required to make public the names of contributors. I know nothing of NY law in this regard.

In the MOU, In anticipation of Clinton's nomination for Sec. of State, The Foundation agreed to publish the names of contributors once and thereafter only the names of new contributors.

Participation from countries is reviewed . Contributions from government agencies and government owned corporations are treated the same as contributions from governments.
The HIV/AIDS work the Foundation does have government sponsors. Contributions, if from governments not previously participating, or from previously participating countries that are substantially increasing their contribution, are reviewed internally by appropriate agency ethics offices and referred to the White House Consul as described in the MOU. See the MOU for specific details.
Participating Countries:
Australia,
Ireland,
Great
Britain,
Sweden,
Canada,
France,
Denmark,
Norway
and the Dominican Republic (COPRESlDIA)
as weIl as the countries who support UNITAID, a consortium of more than 20 countries.- including
France,
Brazil,
Nonvay,
Chile,
Great
Britain
- that fund the purchase of drugs to fight HlV/AIDS.

Disclosure information for other Foundation Activities, such as CGI, is described in the MOU, which please read. .

The Clinton Foundation does important work to aid the poor and dispossessed in many countries. It is ironic that Hillary Clinton has provided the best possible word to describe your own attitude toward the Foundation -- "Despicable".

 

[Slartibartfast]

Unfortunately for you your "distaste" for the person is not enough to end an administration.
You are not alone in your view by any means, but those who do not like the current situation should be marshaling their forces for 2020 versus chasin' trump in circles for 4 yrs.

Since everyone here loves to speculate...here is mine... in 2 1/2 yrs Trump says "been there, done that" I'm going back to the private sector. Here is my man Mike Pence (Koch brothers financed). Dems "hoorah Trump is gone...we are running ...we are running... we are running ?? oh,no....we have done nothing in our party in 4 yrs. we still don't know why white women in Philly, Lansing and Dearborn voted for the evil Trump and not our girl Hil. We have no one......Joe Biden answer your phone ?! Elizabeth W ?
GOP is back on track.

Meh.