The Day Trading Thread

dammitttt, I hate exiting this one early.

I tell you what, trading intraday, have to be able to hold on to those winners.

You just never know and that is what I am trying to tell They and Mark about looking at the background stuff. Here is chart right there to trade, why go look at all that other stuff for.

Just think what independent day trader has all that time for all that. You have to get long or short during the day.

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3 Minute day session chart of QM.

Using a multiday VWAP with Standard Deviation bands and Tillson's Moving average filtered to only plot in direction of VWAP. This is the forest you are lost in the trees to the far lower right of the screen.


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Ok, so lets talk now.

To the left is all that stuff right and here I am for TODAY. I have to trade and make money today. So what do I care about what happen yesterday and the week before and the month before?

I have to enter a trade long or short today right? I have to enter a stop loss right TODAY.

So all I have is what is in front of me. here is today's chart. I am day trader, I have to trade today. Who cares about the forest yesterday? I am not holding these trades for days and weeks. I am in and out in one day.

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Using your chart let me show you something you may be missing. A symmetrical triangle we know is just a channel with converging lines. The bears and bulls are about equal in the pressures they are exerting. That is why the pattern forms. However, the pressure is also BUILDING on both sides. Price will not stay in this pattern. There WILL be a BO. It is 50/50 in either direction. UNLESS you look at the context within which the triangle has formed and the triangles location within the larger context.

Usually the BO will be in the direction of the larger context. But, we must also remember any BO will be followed by an attempt by the other side to make the BO fail. And often, the BO WILL fail and the triangle just becomes the final flag in a bear trend (in this case) jbefore a reversal takes place.

Ok ... look at this chart of yours with these concepts in mind. We can’t see all the context but the immediate context is a bear channel (I drew in the bottom channel line).

In this case the apex is at the top of the bear channel. The expected BO attempt would likely be south (converging patterns here...channel and triangle). So, to short is the higher probability trade. What is a logical PT? Somewhere in the bottom third of the channel.

Then what? Cover and reverse and go long. If I did so and the long position goes against me I would just add to the losing position. Why? BO’s out of a channel fail most of the time and price will go back into the channel. So, if I averaged down on the long I would exit around the middle of the channel. Why not the top for the exit? Because it is a bear channel so pressure is down and I wouldn’t try to capture alot of profit. If I went long at the bottom of the channel and did not need to average down and price reverses up I might hold and exit in the top third of the channel.



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So what happened?

Price broke south out of Apex and traded into the bottom third (dashed blue lines) of the bear channel then reversed back up on that green bull bar into the top third of the channel and (even though you don’t show it in your chart) I suspect it went on up into the top third of the channel and maybe even further as the bulls pushed back against the BO of the triangle (trying to make it fail).

As mentioned earlier this is how I would trade this. My opinion only.

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BOTTOM LINE: any pattern I am considering trading I want to see where it is or has formed at within the larger pattern and what type of pattern the larger pattern is. In addition, at times I will look at a smaller TF and a larger TF than the one I am placing trades in and which contains the pattern i am attempting to trade. Converging patterns can give a better edge. NOT EVERY SYMMETRICAL TRIANGLE IS EQUAL IN PRESSURES IN TERMS OF DIRECTIONAL MOVEMENT ALTHOUGH THE VERY TRIANGLE ITSELF IS EQUAL IN PRESSURES AND THAT IS WHY IT IS SYMMETRICAL. Maybe this will make sense or could be it just muddies the waters for some traders?? Anyways it is my opinion and how I would trade this. But I am a scalper and a discretional one at that.
 
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3 Minute day session chart of QM.

Using a multiday VWAP with Standard Deviation bands and Tillson's Moving average filtered to only plot in direction of VWAP. This is the forest you are lost in the trees to the far lower right of the screen.


GxpbOM.png
MarkBrown,

Thanks, but I am not sure I fully understand you.

My thought process is : Open a chart and trade what I see is happen at the moment in time.
Yes, I look at daily chart. Yes, I look at weekly, but only to drawlines.

But when I turn on my computer in the morning. Time to get busy. Its time to make some decisions, long or short and logical.
 
volpri < there is the best help you have gotten right there - obvious he knows the style you are trading. there is some art to line trading and juggling many possibilities in your head and he explains it very well.



I am just throwing ideas cause I suck trading fixed zones. This is the 1st hour High -Low trading range.

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FIB-A-NACHO LINES BELOW

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3 Minute day session chart of QM.

Using a multiday VWAP with Standard Deviation bands and Tillson's Moving average filtered to only plot in direction of VWAP. This is the forest you are lost in the trees to the far lower right of the screen.


GxpbOM.png
MarkBrown,

Do you see the trade above where crude oil went up strong and fast?

This is why I believe trader have to stare at one chart all day. You do not know what is going to happen next.

I agree with you my 3 minute chart may be too long to wait.
 
1. What does "losing focus of the background " mean?
Not knowing where the breakout/breakdown level you are trading is in relation to the larger time frame levels, where stops would be that could help propel the market further. Not being aware that today has a high likely hood of range contraction which favors 'revert to the mean' strategies vs breakout/breakdown strategies. Not being aware of report timings or respectful of the time of day you are trading.

2. What does "focusing on the foreground." mean?
Staring at 3 minute candle sticks thinking their shape will override/power the day's narrative.

3. What does "larger breakdown" mean?
Trading breakdowns/breakouts for a few ticks will never work. They will only work with larger targets and do not require 3min candles, they just require a sup/res level - line in the sand.

4. What does "Turtle trade" mean?
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/trading/08/turtle-trading.asp

5. What does "day's narrative" mean?
What you think is going to happen, what is the story for today. Was yesterday an inside bar on the daily chart? If yes, the odds for its highs or lows being broken increase and are a place where a breakout/breakdown trade can be initiated with a higher chance of range expansion - "larger breakout/larger breakdown - runner, whatever you want to call it"

6. What does "large range expansion" mean?
Look at a daily chart of oil, the stock indexes, metals, etc and you will see the current daily range to the previous and you will see where price is in relation to yesterday's or the few previous day's highs and lows are. If price can get to those levels and get fueled by stops being activated you have the higher chance of larger range expansion.

I may be wrong but it seems you are trading a mix of price breaking some sup/res levels mixed with an arbitrary read of 3 minute candle shapes. If I am correct you are basically scalping for ticks and are thus not concerned with getting a larger win which requires trading at levels where other people's stops are going to be hit or where larger traders would be initiating trades.

All of us retail traders trade differently, we generally improve by not repeating our mistakes. If you are indeed trying to scalp oil for ticks and are not having any luck try a smaller time frame, 3 minutes is an eternity in tick scalping.


Stay humble, keep learning.
 
volpri < there is the best help you have gotten right there - obvious he knows the style you are trading. there is some art to line trading and juggling many possibilities in your head and he explains it very well.



I am just throwing ideas cause I suck trading fixed zones. This is the 1st hour High -Low trading range.

diSMKL.png


FIB-A-NACHO LINES BELOW

YvPK7G.png
MarkBrown,

Now lets say a trader was starring at Crude Oil all day on 5 minute chart or 10 range chart or whatever.

The trader get tired cause seems choppy right? He call it a day and go play outside.

He missed the big +50 tick trade 30 minutes.

Do you see now? The trader must trade the trenches allllll day long waiting for the opportunity to make money. Stare at the chart, waiting. trader must know how to trade every market condition , every day.

A trader miss these skills if coding all day long and clicking back test button.
 
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Entry light blue arrow.

Now I sit and hope the next resistance level breaks on a one minute chart at the green arrow.

I like to let one minute bar full close before deciding to exit.

This trade got me +30 ticks

Everyday I draw lines all over the chart and trade them if the breakout or reverse.

I am not sure what other way to trade that is simple


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So you watched 3 failed breakdowns at consecutive lower lows and then you got into a long and exited before price tested the day's highs? Nice trade, but do you see living in the moment had you blind even to where today's highs were and the fact that there are stops above that level that will propel price higher giving you more profits?

Foreground - I think its going up
Background - Stops above high of day
 
Do you see now? The trader must trade the trenches allllll day long waiting for the opportunity to make money. Stare at the chart, waiting. trader must know how to trade every market, every day.

yes i hear what you say and agree - i am just saying that if you take that data and spread it out to make it smoother and then use contraction to locate just a few explosive possibilities.

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