the bottom 40% of Americans paid negative 9.1% income taxes

Why are we buying into the idea that any income tax is fair.

1. Why should america be paying interest on it debt? We are a soverign country and we can print.

2. It may have been a reasonable concept when we had a balanced budget. But when you are a perpetual overspender and you are just buying your own debt back via QE... you realize there is no reason to be increasing the debt that americans owe.

3. So lets strike a new deal.
No income tax.. Our govt caps spending here. Fed can stay our banker.

That is a fair arrangement.

If you really think this through it is population and competition control. that is all it is.

Inflation progressive tax and estate taxes are just a way to stop families from accumulating money over time.

4, Obama was talking about lack of class mobility.
That is the purpose of the income tax.

Only the top .5% get to accumulate money and assets.
Most everyone else gets nailed by inflation and progressive taxes.
 
Quote from Tsing Tao:

No, it would be fair to say they all pay whatever flat rate on their income. That's the whole point behind a flat, fair tax. So if little Johnny had a paper route and made $25 per week, he'd pay 20% on that - $5. Dad would pay 20% on his $50,000 a year salary - $10,000. Dad would still pay a hell of a lot more, just fairly. Has nothing to do with how much they consume.

As for you not being "hear" to make friends, you do a good job of it (not making friends). One thing you're actually good at. I don't mind arguing topics, but not for the sake of just having an argument. That would make me a troll like you.

For instance, you don't see me arguing shit like the fact that an allowance or paper route isn't taxable. That's what I'd do if I were just picking a fight - much like you.
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the problem with a flat tax is, nobody can ever get ahead. So, some poor guy just starting out gets his check pilfered by the government to pay for a war that only helps the multinational corporation. There is no way, a middle class taxpayer can pay for the kind of government the big corporation wants. Let the bottom 50% live tax free. Once you hit that upper 50% mark, then it's payback time and flat is as good as anything.. I'm cool with Fica and medicare paid by all at a flat rate. Even the kid with a paper route. Because at least supposedly they are getting something beneficial to them.
 
Quote from jem:

Why are we buying into the idea that any income tax is fair.

1. Why should america be paying interest on it debt? We are a soverign country and we can print.

2. It may have been a reasonable concept when we had a balanced budget. But when you are a perpetual overspender and you are just buying your own debt back via QE... you realize there is no reason to be increasing the debt that americans owe.

3. So lets strike a new deal.
No income tax.. Our govt caps spending here. Fed can stay our banker.

That is a fair arrangement.

If you really think this through it is population and competition control. that is all it is.

Inflation progressive tax and estate taxes are just a way to stop families from accumulating money over time.

4, Obama was talking about lack of class mobility.
That is the purpose of the income tax.

Only the top .5% get to accumulate money and assets.
Most everyone else gets nailed by inflation and progressive taxes.
More...
there is any interesting idea floating around on the local level. And that is replacing all taxes with a property tax. Only the tax is paid simply on amount of land, either square foot or acres. But no assessment is made on the land. So, the guy who owns a vacant lot pays the exact same tax as the guy who builds a condominium on his lot.

And it would be a very high tax. Good luck keeping your grandmother's house you inherited. But then again, she and you would have spent your whole life paying nothing but the property tax.

4. as far as lack of "class" (what is a class? you mean like a Brahmin? or Royalty?)mobility, that's what happens when all the wealth is concentrated into a very few hands. It's very obvious if you spend any time in Mexico. In USA, Warren Buffet is only dealing in billions, no big deal. But Washington D.C. has trillions of concentrated wealth, and they want more.
 
Quote from kid.fx.cross:

the problem with a flat tax is, nobody can ever get ahead. So, some poor guy just starting out gets his check pilfered by the government to pay for a war that only helps the multinational corporation. There is no way, a middle class taxpayer can pay for the kind of government the big corporation wants. Let the bottom 50% live tax free. Once you hit that upper 50% mark, then it's payback time and flat is as good as anything.. I'm cool with Fica and medicare paid by all at a flat rate. Even the kid with a paper route. Because at least supposedly they are getting something beneficial to them.
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That's pretty much what you have now. Not working out very well, is it.

A flat tax doesn't stop people from getting ahead. In fact, just the opposite. It means the harder you work and more money you make, the more you get to keep.
 
Quote from Tsing Tao:

That's pretty much what you have now. Not working out very well, is it.

A flat tax doesn't stop people from getting ahead. In fact, just the opposite. It means the harder you work and more money you make, the more you get to keep.
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yeah, but you have to get over that hump where finally, every month, after all the bills, including taxes, you have a little to invest. After that it goes very fast. Why put an extra burden on the people and make it even harder to get over that hump?
 
Quote from kid.fx.cross:

yeah, but you have to get over that hump where finally, every month, after all the bills, including taxes, you have a little to invest. After that it goes very fast. Why put an extra burden on the people and make it even harder to get over that hump?
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So put an even higher extra burden on the middle class who are shrinking as the sand falls from the hour glass? You need to check out how much the top 50% makes, and pay particular note to the lower 30 percent of that top 50%.
 
Obama just made the speech. ask him what he meant by lack of moblility. I thought it was pretty obvious that taxes and inflation and a locked in underclass were destroying mobility.

But, lefties act like more taxes and more govt is the answer.

Quote from kid.fx.cross:

there is any interesting idea floating around on the local level. And that is replacing all taxes with a property tax. Only the tax is paid simply on amount of land, either square foot or acres. But no assessment is made on the land. So, the guy who owns a vacant lot pays the exact same tax as the guy who builds a condominium on his lot.

And it would be a very high tax. Good luck keeping your grandmother's house you inherited. But then again, she and you would have spent your whole life paying nothing but the property tax.

4. as far as lack of "class" (what is a class? you mean like a Brahmin? or Royalty?)mobility, that's what happens when all the wealth is concentrated into a very few hands. It's very obvious if you spend any time in Mexico. In USA, Warren Buffet is only dealing in billions, no big deal. But Washington D.C. has trillions of concentrated wealth, and they want more.
More...
 
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