that is a good idea. observing them all at the same time in the time increment charts i am comfortable with may give me an idea how they move together. however, it will be hard to follow all at once. i was hoping to get trader feedback for them all individually since many traders here may trade different eminis for different reasons becuase of different experiences.
The big question. How do i sort through the mess of the e-minis?
- Thread starter triggertrader
- Start date
that is a good idea. observing them all at the same time in the time increment charts i am comfortable with may give me an idea how they move together. however, it will be hard to follow all at once. i was hoping to get trader feedback for them all individually since many traders here may trade different eminis for different reasons becuase of different experiences.
You don't necessarily have to trade all of them at once. Trade one contract for 2 days and move onto the next. For me, it all comes down to volume. The more volume the better the fills, the smoother it trades, etc......My obvious choice is the ES. After that the NQ, then YM, then ER2. I've gotten some absolutely brutal fills on the ER2 with market orders. Haven't traded it in a couple years and probably won't go back to it but I know some traders who trade it exclusively. I don't care for the .10 tick size either. I use limits to get out 99.99% of the time and narrowing that down to .10 is hard.
<i>"maybe i should have been more specific. if i am looking to trade using 1 minute charts with a 1-2 point tick profit. if you have traded using these formations and time increments which do you use?"</i>
You need to be a bit more specific on that. If you mean trading for 1 - 2 full points' profit, that is $5 ~ $10 on YM. It is $50 ~ $100 in ES, and $100 ~ $200 in ER.
Considerable difference in profit targets.
If you mean to imply you intend to scalp for one - two ticks' profit objectives using any chart setting period, it does not matter what symbol you trade. End result will be the same... failed and broke.
Trading the ES for +2pts to +10pts / handles (or greater) intraday profit objectives will make money. Trading for two ticks is hopeless.
If you clarify your intent, we can narrow down the choices best for you
You need to be a bit more specific on that. If you mean trading for 1 - 2 full points' profit, that is $5 ~ $10 on YM. It is $50 ~ $100 in ES, and $100 ~ $200 in ER.
Considerable difference in profit targets.
If you mean to imply you intend to scalp for one - two ticks' profit objectives using any chart setting period, it does not matter what symbol you trade. End result will be the same... failed and broke.
Trading the ES for +2pts to +10pts / handles (or greater) intraday profit objectives will make money. Trading for two ticks is hopeless.
If you clarify your intent, we can narrow down the choices best for you
This is something you need to do yourself. It's critical, I've found that you trade instrument(s) that you understand and for lack of a better word "speak" to you.
I can't emphasize this enough. - - Again, trade a product that you can relate to and understand it's behaviours. You'll bond with it as if it were alive.
A lot of legendary traders had stocks or futures that they traded day in and day out.* That's because they knew it so well they could ALMOST predict the future.
If your an expert with....animals (squirrels I'll say)
when you watch them a lot you can predict their behaviour with a much higher degree than most. The animals movements may seem random to most but in watching them daily, you can anticipate what they'll do next. Sports...same thing, you've been playing for sometime and you're comfortable with yourself and you're relaxed. As an outfielder, you can't predict the future but as the batter swings and connects, you (without thinking) react and are moving into the position that ball will go. What we do as traders/investors to the casual observer seems easy. To entry and mid level participants it appears impossible.
Do we predict the future---no. Can we through close observation anticipate an instruments movements and align ourselves to harvest rewards? Most definitely. Observation of your quarry is the key.
Success is dependent upon other factors and discipline is the second most critical element in this formula of seven.
*One must also know when NOT to trade. This knowledge will come with time and exposure.
good point. well of course comparing YM to ER2 to es would mean 10 ticks vs 1 full points (1 hundred dollars in er2) to 2 full points in es. i was talking about it in that context. this is what i meant
Great Post!
Quote from infolode:
This is something you need to do yourself. It's critical, I've found that you trade instrument(s) that you understand and for lack of a better word "speak" to you.
I can't emphasize this enough. - - Again, trade a product that you can relate to and understand it's behaviours. You'll bond with it as if it were alive.
A lot of legendary traders had stocks or futures that they traded day in and day out.* That's because they knew it so well they could ALMOST predict the future.
If your an expert with....animals (squirrels I'll say)
What we do as traders/investors to the casual observer seems easy. To entry and mid level participants it appears impossible.
Do we predict the future---no. Can we through close observation anticipate an instruments movements and align ourselves to harvest rewards? Most definitely. Observation of your quarry is the key.
Success is dependent upon other factors and discipline is the second most critical element in this formula of seven.
*One must also know when NOT to trade. This knowledge will come with time and exposure.
doubtful you can avoid the screen time
has to be done in my opinion
I'm curious why you think that the other markets I mentioned are not for "day trading". In fact, crude oil is a far, far better intraday market than any of the e-minis -- consistent volatility, liquid market, great daily range -- it has it all. The rest of the products I mentioned all have ample intraday opportunity, depending on your trading style.
In the apparent absence of any firsthand knowledge of the modern electronic markets, your decisiveness on the intraday landscape and the timeframe and profit you want to trade is a little odd. It's much more important to know how much you want to lose rather than how much you want to win. If you're only winning one or two ticks in the ES, there's a small chance you might be doing okay. There's a small chance you might be able to break even in the NQ (although I haven't traded it lately). If you're only getting one or two tick winners in the YM or ER2, it's highly likely that you're losing money every day. How do you know you will even have an edge using a one-minute chart on these markets if you don't know them? Maybe your edge really lies in the 30-year bond on a 60-minute chart.
I'm not trying to give you a hard time -- you just seem to be approaching this new experience with a closed mind. No one here could tell you the person whom you would most enjoy dating, and no one here can tell you which market is the best for you. You're an individual with distinct strengths and weaknesses and you need to put a little sweat equity into finding the right fit for yourself.
That "speak to you" is right on. I spent a lot of time in Woodies room years ago and that is what he said. I bumped around with ES, then NQ, didn't like YM at all. Then I found the bonds, ZN and ZF, I like them a bunch.
i have to disagree. let me add i am trading commodities for 10 years. i am no newbie to commodity trading. i have unfortunately traded crude oil and there is slippage. i have never experienced any slippage with the eminis. the eminis are more liquid, have more open interest and volume than crude oil. crude oil margin is also very high. e-minis arent. e-minis also have dirt cheap commissions. crude oil traded in new a york exchange has high commission plus very high exchange fees. the quote fees are also higher than chicago quote fees on the e-minis. so head to head i dont see the advantage of crude over any of the e-minis. however, if day trading crude oil has worked for you and you have made money thats great and stick with it.
as far as me looking to grab 2 ticks. its not ticks, its points. so when i say 2 points i would mean in the russel for example from 719.00 to 721.00. not minimum ticks like from 719.00 to 719.10
that would be crazy. i dont have the intestinal fortitude, speed and nerves to scalp. maybe it works for some but to me its insanity.