T-Cells . The dirty word/s to the forum's home grown vaccine specialist

gwb-trading said:
Yes.. so explain to us once again.... An individual exhibits no detectable Covid anti-bodies from either vaccination or previous infection. What is the probability that they will have a T-cell response to Covid?

What triggers a T-cell response in the body? Please explain to us your theory. Does it magically spring up when no anti-bodies are present?
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By and large, antibodies are produced by activated B lymphocytes (a.k.a. humoral response) whereas T lymphocytes are responsible for the "cellular" response. Both responses are part of the immune system, but they act in different ways and even though I'm not familiar with the details of the articles mentioned, what is being asserted is perfectly possible. So your assumption is wrong. It is perfectly possible to have T Cell response with low or not measurable levels of Antibodies.

Now, I'm not saying that this is the case with COVID or COVID vaccines, because, as I said, I'm not familiar with the details of the studies and articles quoted. I'm not an immunologist, but I am a physician and what I just wrote is pretty basic.
 
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TreeFrogTrader said:
Y'all who followed the hundreds of threads on covid know that certain individuals treated the words "t-cells" like someone shouting fire in a theater. The primary actor there would rise to snuff that out as soon as possible and has held fast to that position.

Nope.

The headlines of articles across the board this week are about how T-cells are not only highly effective against Omicron but are also at the center of efforts to develop a pan-vaccine that will be effective across many/most covid strains.

As I said earlier many times before I dropped out of those repetitive discussions: "T-CELLS, DON'T LEAVE HOME WITHOUT THEM."


T Cells Come to the Rescue as Studies Show They Buck Omicron
  • Unlike antibodies, the cells hold up against variant in tests
  • Findings may explain disconnect between case load and severity
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...the-rescue-as-studies-show-they-fight-omicron
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That's for those vaccinated who still have some viable T-cells left. Several researchers have reported "vaccines harm our immune systems"... mostly in regard to T-cells (some of them) either being destroyed or losing function... and negative effects appear to be cumulative. That is, the more shots/boosters, the greater the cumulative harm.
 
gwb-trading said:
Yet you don't understand the presence of anti-bodies triggers the T-cell response.
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Sorry, but this is wrong. Even though there is an interaction between B and T Cell response, T Cells do not necessarily need antibodies to be activated.
 
Scataphagos said:
That's for those vaccinated who still have some viable T-cells left. Several researchers have reported "vaccines harm our immune systems"... mostly in regard to T-cells (some of them) either being destroyed or losing function... and negative effects appear to be cumulative. That is, the more shots/boosters, the greater the cumulative harm.
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Yes, that could be too. There has always been evidence and argument that the lifetime allotment of t-cells (and for antibody memory cells as well) is somewhat limited or can deplete so you have to be careful about triggering them with vaccinations unless the vaccination protection lasts for decades or so to justify the drawdown.

Lots of arguments to be made about T-cells. I just don't buy into the idea that T-cells and their role cannot be talked about in the light of day here just because one forum member has a hissy fit. It can all be talked about.
 
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NeoTrader said:
Sorry, but this is wrong. Even though there is an interaction between B and T Cell response, T Cells do not necessarily need antibodies to be activated.
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[CITATION NEEDED}

I posted a whole bunch of material for over a year from proper medical journals and sources explaining in detail how B and T-cell responses and antibodies interact and operate in regards to viruses. Have you suddenly discovered some new science?

Are you going to parrot jem - claiming that T-cells would magically protect you against Covid even if you had no anti-bodies. It was all part of the anti-vaxxer "natural immunity" nonsense that these magical T-cells would show up and therefore we were close to "herd immunity". Scientists and fact checks have already refuted this nonsense in great detail.

Explain to us why why they use anti-body tests (and not T-cell tests) to determine if you are protected against Covid (the same with other diseases such as measles, mumps, etc.).
 
TreeFrogTrader said:
AHHHROOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

If antibodies fail, T cells in Covid-recovered people could shield from Omicron, says US study

https://theprint.in/health/if-antib...red-people-from-omicron-says-us-study/780860/
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"Yet to be peer-reviewed, the study has been conducted by US National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases and Johns Hopkins University. It had a sample size of 30."

LOL -- similar to a study in South Africa which had a sample size of 15 which studies if catching Omicron blocks Delta -- the sample size is so small that the results are not really meaningful from a broader perspective.

Plus it is interesting to note the actual study shows that all 30 individuals had detectable antibody levels. All 30 individuals were previously infected. Proof of previous infection was established via anti-body tests.
 
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