Superstition, Luck and Vodoo

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sicilian,

the old testament DOES NOT state in ANY fashion that the earth is only several thousand years old. this is the "young earth theory" and is based on a misinterpretation of the supposed geneological record found in the old testament.

tao dow,

surf:cool:
 
Originally posted by marketsurfer
sicilian,

tao dow,

surf:cool:

Hey Surf would you by any chance be a Taoist Christian???
If so I strongly suggest Thomas Merton's translation of Chuang-Tzu :)
 
Originally posted by SicilianTM
As in the "God the watchmaker"? Created the universe and set it in motion and basically has been hands off ever since?

No, not at all. Just Faith without religion.
 
Originally posted by marketsurfer
sicilian,

the old testament DOES NOT state in ANY fashion that the earth is only several thousand years old. this is the "young earth theory" and is based on a misinterpretation of the supposed geneological record found in the old testament.

tao dow,

surf:cool:

Maybe not, but it is popular among creationists who want to discredit evolutionary theory. Besides that, there is good evidence that the "heavens" and the earth were not created within the same 6 day period. If one wants to argue that these time periods given are merely metaphors, then why would anyone argue against evolution as if it were incompatible with belief in God?
 
Originally posted by Thug_Life


No, not at all. Just Faith without religion.

But what does that mean? As soon as you think you know the characteristics of that God, you are stepping into the realm of religion, even if it's your own personal one. What's the point of having faith in a God you can't know anything about?
 
yes, i definately have leanings toward taoist christianity. i am uncertain how i would define my beliefs to someone else, however. thanks for questioning !!

best,

surf:cool:
 
Originally posted by marketsurfer
yes, i definately have leanings toward taoist christianity. i am uncertain how i would define my beliefs to someone else, however. thanks for questioning !!

best,

surf:cool:

Thats pretty cool for I have never come into contact with a Taoist christian :)

Have you by any chance read the Merton translation I referred to?
I am pretty sure he was a Christian minister and it is my favorate out of the 10 or so transalations I have of the text...

He translated Wu-Wei in such beautiful fashoin;

Flowing like a river
Mind like a pure mirror
Responsive like an echo

And as for being uncertain of defining your beliefs, what would be the point even if you were certain ? :)

May the Tao be with you my friend,
Commisso
 
even if it's your own personal one.

Then maybe I have my own religion, if such a thing is possible. "Personal religion" seems to be a contradiction in terms.
 
Originally posted by darkhorse
additional thought:

If you were a king and wanted to discern the true loyalty of your servants, how would you do it? Ordered respect would be the norm in your presence. Only if you appeared to depart for a time might hidden feelings be unmasked. If you looked into your servants' hearts, the truth would be visible. But only by letting the drama play out would the truth be visible to all.

If you were a king and wanted to discern the true faith of your servants, how would you do it? In comfort and security they would never have reason to doubt you, never have reason to fear. Only if the road was hard and the future uncertain would they be required to trust you. Only if pain and grief knocked loudly at their door would they be required to lean on you. Only if the enemy appeared strong would they call on your strength. It is easy to trust when nothing is at stake, quite another when everything is at stake.

If you were a king and wanted to discern the true wisdom of your servants, how would you do it? You would leave the path in plain sight but make it hard to find. You would allow your enemies to set up obstacles and roadblocks, both outside the faith and within, that your servants might gain strength and understanding in overcoming them. You would warn of false prophets and bad teaching within the faith itself, but would require your servants to dig out the inconsistencies and turn away the pernicious influences rather than doing the work for them. You would make it easy for the humble, hard for the proud. You would have us stumble when we shelter the things you despise most: arrogance, ego, small mindedness, pettiness, inflated sense of self. You would make it easy to blow off the truth and mock trivialities instead. You would make it hard to put aside distractions and listen to heart and mind with no bias except desire to know what makes ultimate sense, what is ultimately real.

If you were a king and wanted to discern the true submissiveness of your servants, how would you do it? You would make it clear to them that there is only one true power, only one true ruler. You would do as you please and apologize to no one, set the standards of your own hand and have your entire kingdom abide by them. You would answer questions in a way and time of your own choosing, if at all, and your answer would be your answer. Period. Inquiries would be welcomed, sought wisdom granted, humble searching rewarded, grateful worship accepted- but arrogant rebellion crushed.

If you were a king and wanted to demonstrate mercy and justice, how would you do it? You would show mercy by granting forgiveness of those who truly seek it. You would accept gifts of worship and service if born of the proper gratitude. But being just, you could not sweep wrongdoing under the rug. Atonement would be required before forgiveness. A price must be paid. Blood must be shed.

If you were a king and wanted to demonstrate the limitless scope of your power, how would you do it? Perhaps by laughing at the worldy trappings of power, the pathetic popsicle stick shacks erected by man. If you walked the earth you would not seek the glory of military might, or the silly oohs and aahs of monetary wealth, or the short term satisfaction of sending your enemies tumbling with a flick of your finger. No- to a true king, to a creator and sustainer of the universe, the world's myopic definitions of success and power would have all the immediacy and gravitas of kindergarden sandbox games. As a king you would reject shallow notions of power and thus demonstrate what true power is. Your followers would beg of you to set up camp on a patch of dirt and enforce your rule with a sword, not realizing that your plan is to demonstrate the grandness of your rule over the entire time scale of the entire universe, that your power is so vast and immense it would hurt a man's mind to even try and conceive of it without proper preparation and baby steps of forethought.

In the end, you would display a full panorama of your attributes, all the elements within your character that were reflected in your creation: logic, reason, beauty, creativity, compassion, mercy, love, justice, righteousness, patience, anger, wrath. You would show infinite patience, waiting as you do beyond the boundaries of space and time and not just knowing but deciding beforehand how the story will end. You would show infinite love through compassionate sacrifice. And ultimately you would mete out infinite wrath to those who would stand against you- not by destroying them, but by casting them away from your presence fully and completely for all time. To those who reject you, you would grant them rejection as a final request.

This is the last mile. This is why we are here, it is why our hearts beat, it is what our hearts and minds whisper to us when our eyes are opened. It is the Real.

The majority view is meaningless. One man and the truth is a majority. Do not measure out smugness against the folly of your fellow men. Right or wrong, your neighbor's reasoning should ultimately have little bearing on your own.

In the end, it does not matter what you think of God. It only matters what He thinks of you.



Very poetic dark, you almost brought me to tears (tears of laughter that is:-)

You forget something, *I* am not just a mere king but *I* am an ominpotent and
omniscient being. Why would *I* create this boring melodrama in the first place?
OK, let's see, is this how it goes: *I* wake one morn and decide that wouldn't it
be interesting to start an "ant farm" on an obscure piece of space flotsam. C'mon
dark, why would *I* care? *I* am the biggest baddest thing in the universe.

Why would *I* bother?
 
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