That's another benefit of an H1B visa (from the perspective of the employer) that I did not consider earlier. Imagine someone on an H1B visa contemplating joining a union. If they get fired, they got 3 months to line up another sponsor. Few people would join a union and take that risk. So H1B's also help prevent the workforce from unionizing.
Software Engineer: $7,000 a year in China, $8,400 in India... $90,000 in U.S.
- Thread starter kmiklas
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That's another benefit of an H1B visa (from the perspective of the employer) that I did not consider earlier. Imagine someone on an H1B visa contemplating joining a union. If they get fired, they got 3 months to line up another sponsor. Few people would join a union and take that risk. So H1B's also help prevent the workforce from unionizing.
Yes, the entire US visa system is totally messed up imo. H1b should be exclusively granted to students who study in the US and qualify (meaning, are equally or better than their US permanent resident counterparts). And having ties whatsoever in the US should not even factor into the equation whether a non resident qualifies or not. What you have right now is entire Korean, Chinese, Indian, and Pakistani "tribes" who bring the remaining clan to the US. It's a very bad system and not based on merit at all.
The professions who need H1B visas don't have unions and won't any time soon.
I have a question for all you folks that think Indian/Chinese software engineers/computer engineers are inferior to US software engineers/computer engineers: Why then are they running Google and Microsoft and a few other major internet/social media/software companies? In the US about half the high tech companies are founded and run by foreign born engineers so we should not generalize. I am thankful we accept and welcome those "foreigners", our economy and prosperity need them.
Would not surprise me that one of these days in the not too distant future, India and China will be as good if not better than the US in the high tech businesses because they are the "low cost producers" and they study and work twice as hard as most of us in the US. If you visit India and China recently you can appreciate what I just said.
Best wishes to all of you.
Would not surprise me that one of these days in the not too distant future, India and China will be as good if not better than the US in the high tech businesses because they are the "low cost producers" and they study and work twice as hard as most of us in the US. If you visit India and China recently you can appreciate what I just said.
Best wishes to all of you.
But he did not say only US programmers and developers are good.
You misunderstood us. There are spectacular Indian and Chinese software devs. They are all making market rates or close to it, as they should be. This thread is about dirt cheap offshore teams, where you get what you pay for. Huge difference.
Absolutely. I've said this at least 3 times on this thread alone, software development isn't linear and a good dev can easily be 10x more productive than an OK one. Productive doesn't mean lines of code written, it means good code, well documented, minimal bugs and easy to debug, easy for anyone else to come into later and modify or extend, that does what you want without you having to practically write the code yourself in specs and then have him rewrite over and over because it's still not what you wanted, who understands the underlying business application the code is supposed to accomplish rather than pedantically converting a spec to code, who can suggest better ways to accomplish your underlying goal, or more efficient ways, who can estimate the time required for a job well and meets the deadline promised.... And that's before you start talking about all the devs that destroy value with crap code and bugs that hit your brand, late deliveries of said crap code...In my experience that's what cheap contract offshoring gets you. On the flip side, I've brought top coders from Asia over as paid interns to work in-house for a year while finishing their degrees and gotten spectacular results, so I don't think it's culture as much as adverse selection of who you get when you offshore for cheap.
I think that it's ridiculous to assume that a U.S. Developer writes code that is 10x better than an offshore coder.
I have worked with some brilliant offshore coders, and some not-so-brilliant U.S. developers.
Here, I assume an apples-to-apples comparison. Two people with equivalent experience, intelligence, skill set, and skill level.
Say for example a mid-level Dev. In the US, that skill set would cost, say, $110,000/year. If offshored, the same skill set would cost $18k?
Why is that same talent so much cheaper offshore? That's a HUGE difference in price.
Is someone getting a free lunch here?
I have worked with some brilliant offshore coders, and some not-so-brilliant U.S. developers.
Here, I assume an apples-to-apples comparison. Two people with equivalent experience, intelligence, skill set, and skill level.
Say for example a mid-level Dev. In the US, that skill set would cost, say, $110,000/year. If offshored, the same skill set would cost $18k?
Why is that same talent so much cheaper offshore? That's a HUGE difference in price.
Is someone getting a free lunch here?