Socialism for the rich, free market darwinism for the poor & middle class

zdreg · Mar 17, 2008

Quote from detective:

BSC bond holders are in high heaven because of the Fed. They are getting bailed out. Those bonds would have been worth close to zero without Fed intervention, and now with the help of the Fed, they are worth much much more.

If you don't call that a bailout what do you call it? And you don't think the Fed backstop is not costing taxpayers (actually dollar holders) money when they essentially provide a disaster put to JP Morgan for free?

are any of these bonds publicly traded?

flyingiguana · Mar 17, 2008

imo the government should get options related to the assets they are gonna guarantee. i don't think companies should get a free lunch especially when they're able to buy a high quality name at bargain basement prices with their tushies covered in the transaction.

Humpy · Mar 17, 2008

""Bush yesterday said he won't be stampeded into ``bad policy decisions'' that might harm the economy.""

Well that's reassuring Georgie

Trader5287 · Mar 17, 2008

What about the CC? Did any of you listen to it?

I think Schwarz has some legal problems.

blackjack007 · Mar 17, 2008

Quote from Cutten:

Better still, abolish the fractional reserve system entirely.

and replace it with what, a full-reserve system? i hope you're not serious.

Cutten · Mar 17, 2008

Quote from blackjack007:

and replace it with what, a full-reserve system? i hope you're not serious.

Yes, a full reserve system. Remove the banks' ability to create additional money out of thin air. Banks would be in the business of taking deposits, loaning them out, and earning the spread. As opposed to creating money out of thin air, leveraging up to absurd levels, and jeapordizing customer deposits with a glorified pyramid scheme as a result.

Raul641 · Mar 17, 2008

Quote from Cutten:

Yes, a full reserve system. Remove the banks' ability to create additional money out of thin air. Banks would be in the business of taking deposits, loaning them out, and earning the spread. As opposed to creating money out of thin air, leveraging up to absurd levels, and jeapordizing customer deposits with a glorified pyramid scheme as a result.

That works great in a medieval agrarian economy with infintesimal economic growth. But that makes it practically impossible to have any sort of industrial technology, let alone computers. Economic growth would be completely hobbled by lack of money and credit.

Landis82 · Mar 17, 2008

Quote from Pa(b)st Prime:

There's so many fallacies in your argument I don't know where to begin.

You keep harping upon "taxpayers". There's not an iota of public funds involved in this deal. Even if there were unlike the U.K. this is a country where the rich are just about the only taxpayers of consequence anyways.

Do see any evidence of BSC stockholders being "saved" by this plan? Or the holders of distressed securities?

Pabst, these guys just don't get the magnitude of what has been going on in the banking sector.

Can you imagine what would have happened to Bear ( and others ) had the FED stood by and done absolutely nothing in order to "support" the dollar like these Neanderthals wanted months ago?

Can you imagine where the Economy would be right now if the FED just sat there doing nothing going back to last Fall?

Avid_Consumer · Mar 17, 2008

Quote from Raul641:

That works great in a medieval agrarian economy with infintesimal economic growth. But that makes it practically impossible to have any sort of industrial technology, let alone computers. Economic growth would be completely hobbled by lack of money and credit.

could you also say that in a mature economy with a naturally slowing rate of growth, fractional reserve lending results in malinvestment and wealth concentration, rather than real sustainable economic growth?

Landis82 · Mar 17, 2008

Quote from Raul641:

That works great in a medieval agrarian economy with infintesimal economic growth. But that makes it practically impossible to have any sort of industrial technology, let alone computers. Economic growth would be completely hobbled by lack of money and credit.

Exactly.

But these guys ( Cutten, Detective, Aaron Copland, S2007S ) don't seem to understand that as a nation, the United States has a horrible savings rate. It was actually NEGATIVE for the entire year of 2005. As a result, there is no capital formation generated for credit creation and economic expansion.

That's why we have the FED.
If our nation actually had a decent SAVINGS RATE, the FED wouldn't have to make up such a large part of the economic stimulus! But there is no SAVINGS RATE. Instead, we have a government that spends, spends, spends like a drunken sailor on shore leave. Thanks Bush & Cheney!
You idiots.

It's that simple.