Russa Invades Georgia - Full Scale Invasion

Quote from sameeh55:

Go Russia go! We are all "South Ossetian" now!!
More...
What a surprise. Of course you all are.

You people are all Hezbollah, you are all Al-Qaeda, you're all Hamas, you are all Taliban, you side with Chavez, Ahmadinejad, Assad and Castro, you support and defend every anti-american idiot anywhere in the world no matter how despicable his views/actions/policies are. It's only logical that you support Putin and his illegal invasion of a sovereign democratic country, nothing less is expected from you.

You also believed that Georgia committed genocide in Ossetia, did not you?
Fewer than 100 civilians died in Georgia's breakaway province of South Ossetia during last month's war, human rights activists said Thursday
 
a_person,

do you really, really want to get into all the breaches of international law committed by Israel?

Are you trying to take the high road here? Israel - the country in the world closest to Apartheid rule... militarized to the teeth. Please...

... and for f. sake - who do you mean "you people are all"?
Are you jumping on a contradiction bonanza again? Take a red pill!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leap_of_faith
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degree_of_truth
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denialism
 
Quote from Gringinho:

do you really, really want to get into all the breaches of international law committed by Israel?
More...
LOL, is that the best you can do to justify the invasion and occupation of Georgia that you people support? You claimed you supported it because Georgia committed genocide (or so Putin told useful idiots). Now that cretins who believed Putin have become a laughing stock of the planet they try to justify their support by claiming that "Israel did it too". If this is not pathetic I don't know what is.

But guess what, my post had nothing to do with international law which frankly is not worth the paper it's written on. My post was about the fact that some people tend to support democracies like the US, Israel, Georgia, others consistently side with rogue states, regimes and leaders like Chavez, Ahmadinejad, Putin and Bin Laden.

And one more thing - Israel is a small country occupying 0.2% of the regional land and surrounded by 23 hostile states outnumbering the Jews by 70 to 1 and committed to wiping Israel off the map earlier or later. Come again, what does the situation in the Middle East have in common with the Russian invasion of Georgia? Did Georgia kidnap russian citizens, blow up women and children in russian malls and pizza parlors, lobbed Qassams and Katyushas into russian towns?
 
Hello

I am from Russia. let me speak out.
It is true that both sides were wrong, both Georgia and Russia. It seems that everybody is so happy to be involved in a new "cold war" and it is also true that current leaders of Russia are eager to restore Soviet Union, it is painful for them that smb amonth their "childern" will go to another parent.
Though enthusiasm of USA to resist this "agressor" just makes Russia more crazy, it contributes to the view that West intends to cut Russia and hurt decent Russian soal. So it would be better if all presidents care about their own economies.
 
Broco,

just like in any type of chess - there are "forced plays" - where you force your opponent to do something, because you are threatening him.

Those are closed systems constructed for game and fun, but some people take this simplistic bivalent ruleset and apply it to all their thinking of the real world. Some of these deductive rules can be transferred, and others cannot.

Real life is a whole lot more complicated than a chess game...
I tried to look at what kind of "plays" were being forced by someone inferring such thinking, since there are systemic parallels to practical defence theory application.
 
Former Secretary of State - Colin Powell - said tonight that it was a forced play, that it was totally predictable. He basically depicted Saakashvili as an idiot - and made John McCain look like an idiot too.

We are NOT all Georgians, apparently.


Then Madeleine Albright also verbally fisted the mouth of Sarah Palin.

Maybe there is some reason left after all... hindsight is always 20/20, right? Palin can kiss her chances away with her red lipstick now. With the credit crisis and the clarification on Georgia - the McCain/Palin presidency can officially be called off. Absolutely sure.

The Neoconservative greedy, aggressive, elite theory, corrupt morons and political radicals with roots of Trotskyism are officially getting booted out of Power Politics. They are a cancerous growth on humanity - sapping into everything they can get their sick sticky longing suckers into ...
Getting rid of systemic corruption ... Reason and wisdom has lifted the smoky veil from the eyes of the United States. Yeah! Go USA!
:D


I reason using systems theory and adaptive deductive systems (I studied quite a lot of model theory), and there is NO WAY in hell that McCain is winning now... It is all over.
 
Amazingly, the situation in Georgia is still being tilted...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7651097.stm
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,3689116,00.html

Car bombs have by many military/defence intelligence experts been touted as the ultimate weapon in urban warfare. Government supported training in car bombing has been going on for decades...

http://subtopia.blogspot.com/2006/04/genealogy-of-car-bomb.html
‘Poor man’s air force’, as Mike Davis calls it, has reached a new apex today as the global insurgents’ weapon of choice.

The car bomb is now legitimately “comparable to airpower in its ability to knock out critical urban nodes and headquarters as well as terrorize the populations of entire cities,” he says, not to mention its effect “at destroying the moral credibility of a cause and alienating its mass base of support,” which is very similar to the way aerial bombardment campaigns have always functioned as a psychological weapon, demoralizing the enemy by having things hurled down at them from the sky.

Davis cites Steve Coll from his book Ghost Wars who writes, "the vast training infrastructure” that the Americans helped to build “with the enormous budgets endorsed by NSDD-166 -- the specialized camps, the sabotage training manuals, the electronic bomb detonators, and so on -- would be referred to routinely in America as ‘terrorist infrastructure.'”


Whoever is destabilizing the Georgia situation with Russia is seemingly pretty pathetic, and it seems pretty unsuccessful. This bombing comes just on the eve of the yearly event between Germany and Russia called the "St. Petersburg Dialogue" since it's inception six years ago. Gerhard Schröder who founded the event with Vladimir Putin, now represents Russian energy company Gazprom.

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,3680552,00.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7647729.stm

The whole destabilization reeks pretty badly. A continued analysis of who are to gain from this bombing and all of the destabilization - is an objective, neutral view of the situation - but also very telling of how geopolitics are still being dealt with. It seems the "global war of ideas" and "winning hearts and minds" are still the guidelines for many effects based operations.

http://www.anglospherechallenge.com
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Geographical_Pivot_of_History
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects-Based_Operations
http://www.defenselink.mil/transcripts/transcript.aspx?transcriptid=1206

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Davis_(scholar)
http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2002/01/cia_langley.html
http://www.tni.org/detail_page.phtml?page=pin-docs_230900
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_activities_in_Iran
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_activities_in_the_Americas
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_of_the_Americas
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Gladio

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A27452-2001Oct20?language=printer


"Old-money" interests have a lot riding on keeping the control over energy flows, markets and resources. They are no doubt much more directly involved and with more clout in practical foreign policy than anyone else - and at least much more than the democratic populations of nations.

I truly hope Neo-conservatives are kicked out of every aspect of practical political influence after the Bush era is over...
 
Just other links on the whole sordid "business" of car-bombing and covert operations, destabilization and geopolitics.

Davis is impressed by this disproportion of effect to effort. Car bombs are stealth weapons that are a cheap and operationally straightforward way of getting explosives to a target, and they make enough noise that they cannot be ignored. For these reasons, they are the ultimate in asymmetry. But if they empower the weak, they also tend to be indiscriminate -- so they particularly empower those who are not concerned about carnage.
http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20070...-s-wagon-a-brief-history-of-the-car-bomb.html


http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20041112/news_lz1e12ignatiu.html
http://www.mossadeq.com/languages/english/index.html
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/apr/15/world/fg-proxy15
http://web.archive.org/web/20071214...php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=526
http://www.altpr.org/?q=node/2 (Editorial: Electoral Democracies, Imperial Nightmares)
 
The whole business of destabilization and covert operations is an absolute madness...

http://2164th.blogspot.com/2008/02/terrorist-sons.html

Bombings, covert operations, terrorism and assassinations will only become more prolific if the trend is not stopped. Technology and education empowers the terrorists just as much as it empowers any professional or person living in a poor country. It is akin to "Moore's law"...

I cannot see how a continued policy of fear, interventions and social control can continue... not with the Internet and democracy becoming so widespread. It is impossible to control regions or populations like before... i.e the control of world resources are no longer controllable - because information and populations are being set free with technology. The terrorism is a strike back at the old way of using military force for oppression and power projection - the stuff simply does not work any longer... unless you kill them all, which is just sick.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_operations_other_than_war
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asymmetric_warfare
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_projection
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_generation_warfare
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shock_and_awe

Unless democracy is protected from abuse and corruption - this shit is only going to become much worse as "normal people" become increasingly more powerful and can strike back against "power politics".

Quite sickening, the whole thing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_politics
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Managerial_state
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shock_Doctrine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milieu_control
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_control_theory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_control
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decision_theory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choice_Modelling
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operations_research
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rational_choice_theory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indoctrination
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_conditioning
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAND_Corporation

My bet is on direct democracy to rid nations of the corruption from "old-money conservatives" and ideological maniacs like the Neo-conservatives.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_democracy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representative_direct_democracy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futures_studies
 
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