Question for Traders Who's Main Income Comes From Trading

[JRL]

Quote from sheda:

You can of course decide to paper trade for the next two years but this is not going to expose you to the issues that arise in a live market environment. After two years of paper trading your method will be as equipt to deal with the difference of paper VS live as it is today..

OK, so what are these "issues that arise in a live market environment"? This is exactly what I want to know; this is the point of the thread.

So far, I've received one valuable piece of information related to the above question, and it was from someone on Page 1 who suggested that the fills in a "real" market environment are significantly worse/more difficult than in a sim. That's great, I appreciate that, and any elaboration on how to overcome that challenge would be welcomed.

What are these other "issues"? I understand, also, the emotional shift that will likely take place when trading one's own, hard-earned cash, vis-a-vis a sim.

 

[efficiency]

Quote from JRL:

Why?

What's the difference if you're using live market data? You're already participating with the "seasoned pros", just not using actual cash.

A 10 day "sample" is not statistically significant.

Toss in the present "turmoil". Eight consecutive down days.

Then add slippage.

Then add the internal bias of having $$$ at stake rather than a detached external observation.

Then..........stir.

 

[sheda]

Quote from JRL:

OK, so what are these "issues that arise in a live market environment"? This is exactly what I want to know; this is the point of the thread.

So far, I've received one valuable piece of information related to the above question, and it was from someone on Page 1 who suggested that the fills in a "real" market environment are significantly worse/more difficult than in a sim. That's great, I appreciate that, and any elaboration on how to overcome that challenge would be welcomed.

What are these other "issues"? I understand, also, the emotional shift that will likely take place when trading one's own, hard-earned cash, vis-a-vis a sim.

Do you want us to trade for you as well? The only valuable information you will see is information from your own experience and when you have the experience to judge the value of information out side of that it will come in useful.

Every one has a different method and different problems, its not an A-Z never changing accounting strategy if you haven't got the balls to dip your foot in and study one trade per time live VS what you have already learned on your own, being told is not going to provide much.

 

[Shanb]

A few possibilities...you have a natural ability to read markets and trade them. Or you just got lucky and the first 10 days you traded happened to fit with whatever way you were trading!

FYI...when I first papertraded NG, ZW, ZC, ZS futures I doubled my demo account in the first 2 weeks. I thought I was set...I wasn't lol

 

[Crazycod]

My thoughts would be that 10 days is a very short time to have experienced the full roller coaster ride that is the markets. However if you have a system that is profitable and you are keen to take up trading as a full time pursuit then I would say go for it. Open up a small account that you won't miss and start trading live with real skin in the game. The big difference between live trading and paper trading with a sim is mainly psychological. All of a sudden that 1 or 2 tick loss suddenly seems so much bigger. Or that 1 or 2 tick gain seems so much smaller. Trading 1 contract in crude will not affect the fills too much unless the market is really running or you are trading outside rth. That's my thoughts anyway. Good luck.

 

[Laissez Faire]

Quote from efficiency:

A 10 day "sample" is not statistically significant.

Exactly. It could simply be luck

JRL,

The difference between live trading and demo trading is illustrated below. Believe me, it changes everything Thanks to NoDoji for the picture.

I do however believe that it is the right approach to start with the simulator. 10 days is simply not enough though. Keep practicing and make yourself a solid businessplan.

Trade the plan, be successful in demo over some period of time and then go live with minimum size.

Alternatively, you could find something "cheap" to trade and go live sooner. Not crude oil though.

Another thing to consider: How many contracts are you trading in your sim account? It`s not realistic if you trade 10 contracts and plan on opening a 10K account when you go live.

Regards,

LF

 

[SnakeEYE]

JRL,find a mentor that would show you what it is that you exactly should do,but more importantly what not to do .

good luck

 

[SnakeEYE]

Quote from Aok:



You're not human if your sphincter does NOT tighten up when it's crunch time. In trading every trade is crunch time.

but what if it widens up?

 

[ElecEquity]

Quote from JRL:


I'm not so naive to think that it's this easy when dealing with real money, but what exactly am I missing? What changes when you move from paper to cash (besides the obvious)?

It's the upstream swim against our emotions. The best way to find out is to go live. Check out Lucias' journal. I think he [auto]traded sim, went live, and I think he's now negative. Nothing personal against him, but trading live is a lot different than a sim.

When you're down on the day on sim, you probably keep swinging as if it's no big deal...that may change when you go live. You may 2nd guess yourself, your mind may start to only focus on negative possibilities, etc... Everyone is different. You may end up trading exactly like you do on sim....but I doubt it.

Just go live and you'll find out more than you'll ever find out by asking anyone on ET.

 

[SnakeEYE]

Quote from oldtime:


If you're an accountant, emotions should be no problem when you switch to real money.

i think synchronized swimming is better

or marching or any activity that requires repeating the same things over and over.