Question for Grob/Hershey...

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Quote from mgin:





Danth, you may want to work on your wash (and when/why you should take them) since its considered a "beginner" skill. Moreso than anything else it will keep you "in the game" by forcing you to sideline and reorient yourself. There are many times where doing everything exactly right puts you in a situation to require a wash, and you just do it. You need to be able to discern these situations from the other situations where you just entered for some singular reason and you need to wash because you're a moron. One says I was "there", then you typically remain on the right side of the market. The other says I was on the other side of "there". Reversing here will often find you whipsawed, because the correct reversal will soon follow and if you weren't able to take the wash when it presented itself, you may not be inclined to take the correct reversal. However, if you insist on this method, you would want to look up the IF2 reversal.[/size] [/B]
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i'm trying to understand what you're saying here, but i'm having difficulty...

if you'll look back at my previous posts you'll see that i haven't taken anything but washes...the exception being today where i thought it wouldn't be possible to wash so i exited and reversed.

i don't understand what you mean by 'one says i was 'there'"...what is there?

insist on what method? what do you think i am insisting on? we both know washing is essential yes? it is essential to be on the right side of the market...the wash helps with this right?
if a rocket fails and you wash, are you not most likely poised to reverse onto the right side of the market?

i don't understand where you are disagreeing with what i'm doing (if you are). that's the problem i think.

how does a wash opportunity present itself 100% of the time taking rocket trades? If a rocket becomes an FTT and that rapidly moves against you and doesn't come back (it's rare of course) how does one handle that?

my own logic says: hmm, if the move against me is unwashable outright, then it SHOULD also be strong enough for me to reverse and recoup my loss...

i don't undestand what IF1 or IF2 means, i'm trying to search for a definition on ET

(don't take my response as antagonistic, i get easily frustrated, it's not personal.)

and btw, it looks like you're doing a fantastic job, if you're not trading for real at this point, may i ask why not?
 
Here's a great discussion with Jack about using APA, IF1, and IF2. If you read between the lines, you will see some of where washing comes into play and where not. It cleared up a lot of things for me regarding the trading description and the concepts it discusses.

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22612&perpage=6&pagenumber=2

The discussion about APA/IF1/IF2 doesn't start until near the end, but the beginning gives some context.

HTH
Anthony
 
Quote from Dantheman:
it is essential to be on the right side of the market...the wash helps with this right?
if a rocket fails and you wash, are you not most likely poised to reverse onto the right side of the market?
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Yes, that is true. However if you don't have the skills yet to do wash & reverse, the wash helps you (get on the right side of the market) by first getting you out of the market so you can catch a breath and catch up.

The very real danger is catching a quick ending rocket. If I remember correctly, all rockets end with CCC; if you get in and then it starts shifting to CCC, trying to reverse could very well get you taking the wrong ends of bars in your reverse attempts.

This is an awful place to be. You're rocket just died out and it is now going against you... 2 pts... 3 pts... you reverse right as the direction changes. Now you are down 4 pts... 5 pts... you try and reverse again - right at the bar end - and so it goes on. Talk about building bad pathways in your brain. :(

I know. I did it one day.

HTH - if nothing else, someone else can learn from my mistake.

Anthony
 
Quote from Dantheman:

i have as a confluence of indications:
channel break
vol. >< opposite color of entry vol.
MACD >< -.4/.4
stoch. (now the fast line IN is the signal to begin the wash sequence to me...the other factors coming into view is the determinent i am using that washing is NOT possible).
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Have you looked at tracking PRV? The one rocket I saw in real time rode the LTL - which indicates to me that PRV should at least be as high as when the rocket started, and should sustain during it's lifetime.

Anthony
 
I agree mgin on your ST assessment. I attached my 15 min also.

As far as washes go Easy is on the money. If a trade is already against you, you have already passed the washing opportunity. If you enter correctly you will be presented with a chance to wash, either 10 seconds or 10 minutes after you enter. I trade beginner level 10k and above pace, 15 and 20k if I'm not with it. Look up Easy's "DUH" trade, these are my bread and butter, a L to R traverse coming off the RTL changing to a R to L traverse. Price comes off the rtl as volume increases, I notice the change from L to R to R to L, I look for it to continue, as PRV increases I see my trade coming, prv goes thru 20k, I hit T. prv stays at 20k, still 20k, ____, 18K,16K. I missed the wash. A wash is a nothing thing for me If I enter and nothing happens I wash, If I enter and it continues I bank. I look for no possibility to continue not no possibility to wash. I agree with Aweissen, washes are a very important thing to have down, once understood and implemented they make for a different feeling, you can learn the market without ever giving your money to the market.
 

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Wow, good responses all. Thx for cleaning up my mess. Danth, everyone else explained it much better than I but I'll reply since you addressed me.

i'm trying to understand what you're saying here, but i'm having difficulty...

That's ok. Sometimes I have a hard time understanding what I'm thinking. Trying to convey it often compounds the problem.

i don't understand what you mean by 'one says i was 'there'"...what is there?

It's just a reference to Jack's "NOW", but in hindsight. A play on words really.

From what I've seen, NOW is not just about knowing what's going on NOW. It's about knowing what possibilities lay several minutes ahead of NOW and having a plan for each scenario. One of the branches should be to wash. As everyone pointed out, failure to do so when it is required, puts you in a place where it may not be possible to wash, so next branch in the tree is sideline. To me, it is very telling if you are finding yourself in a position of not being able to wash. All I'm saying is, consider mastering wash and sideline before reverse (see aweissen's post).

(don't take my response as antagonistic, i get easily frustrated, it's not personal.)

Forgetaboutit....maybe you should can the rest of what I said. You're doing rockets and I speak mostly from a moronic aspiring SCT'er point of view. Lesson learned [/endjabber :)]

and btw, it looks like you're doing a fantastic job, if you're not trading for real at this point, may i ask why not?

I've been whipped in two account resurrections already (non-Jack trading) and SCT Jacking is probably the only way I can cope with going live again. I have tremendous respect for icarus, easy, BA or any others who are making a living EHE trading Jack's methods. I just don't think I have the balls and makeup to depend on that to replace a 200k salary day-in and day-out. I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying right now I don't believe I can do it. I'm an overcomplicated putz who feels he needs the strenuous exercise and disciplined rigours of SCT before I can feel confident in my ability to trade for a living. So in a twisted sense, SCT is therapy for me, though if it can't be done consistently, I may be screwed.

I think the others covered the rest of your questions so I'll shut up now and let the real traders post.
 
Is there something like a normal "offspring"/delta between es and ym? I mean sort of a synch?
I understand that it can´t be exact cause it´s not the same index.
 
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