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Question for Grob/Hershey...
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Quote from txuk:
15min, 30min, 60min charts
this is the point that I struggle the most with... we have broken the RTL but is this a new downward channel or adjust the pt3 on existing TL?
I am not sure but I think the overnight data on your charts might inhibit you from drawing the ST and LT channels.
Quote from tradingbug:I am not sure but I think the overnight data on your charts might inhibit you from drawing the ST and LT channels.
This is a good point I've been meaning to ask about. I've noticed most of the charts posted in this thread do not contain overnight data.
Is the idea that volume is so low overnight that those bars should be ignored altogether?
mark the overnight high and low with horiztonal tick marks. Otherwise leave the ON session off of your charts.Quote from txuk:
This is a good point I've been meaning to ask about. I've noticed most of the charts posted in this thread do not contain overnight data.
Is the idea that volume is so low overnight that those bars should be ignored altogether?
Tradingbug and BA, thanks for the suggestions. I had not realized how much the ON bars interrupted the flow.
Here is the 15-30-60 updated.
Do you consider the channels I have marked ITs or STs?
I sense that I should be annotating a larger channel that contains these.
Here is the 15-30-60 updated.
Do you consider the channels I have marked ITs or STs?
I sense that I should be annotating a larger channel that contains these.
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Quote from txuk:
Tradingbug and BA, thanks for the suggestions. I had not realized how much the ON bars interrupted the flow.
Here is the 15-30-60 updated.
Do you consider the channels I have marked ITs or STs?
I sense that I should be annotating a larger channel that contains these.
The objective is to have all channels on the same chart.
What I mean by this is that you want to form a series of envelopes of the channels.
This is going to happen for you as you realize to look at the whole picture more and more.
You will not need too many channels. But it is important to have the LT, IT and ST channels and your intraday trading stuff.
The LT is the outer channel boundary. Within it you see the IT moves.
The short term fits into the IT envelope.
Once you can do this, then you know when you are approaching a boundary. It is successively more difficult for the market to change direction in the ST going to IT going to LT.
We trade the volatility of the short term.
At times price moves to places where the limit of more than one channel envelope is at play. This is where you are seeing two left sides approaching the same value. One is within the other and the slower one is pressing against a longer term envelope as well.
For edge traders, trading their usual edge, this is the time they hit what they call a "home run" It just so happens that they entered at a time when an inner and an outer channel were both coming to an end and PT 1 was setting up for two channel durations simultaneously.
right now it appears you have separate charts for each channel you are considering. start with a longer term chart and do the channel to get long term. Then zoom in with that chart to a lesser duration and draw the traverses of the long term as IT channels. Zoom again and fill in the ST traverses of the IT channels.
You then can zoom in to the duration where the trading occurs.
All of this super position is helpful. use differing colors and /or widths as well. Then you can readily ID the different envelopes when they come into view on your trading channel.
I tried to get this across with stalker in the beginning. I referred to the assorted channel lines as the boundary of a putting green. This was to try to illustrate how to give consideration to the "hold" periods that are involved in maximizing "holds".
Another point is this. The only value of channels is their projections. The LT, IT and ST must be projected. they are projected ASAP. THis is they are projected at the time they begin which is a time when they are overlapping the prior channel.
There are people, today, alive and trading who do not believe a channel can be drawn until after it is over. The only time you draw old channels is when you find out how to get set up and to begin projecting channels. Once you are doing daily maintenance on channel annotation most of all, all you are doing is drawing extensions and new traverses within the channels you use intraday.
Two bars are required to project. A third bar is used to make small adjustments of the original projection.
As your projections move, they move from the future into the present where there is a bar filling in between your projections.
Projections move from left to right on your screen. At least 1/3 of your screen is blank and is on the right side.
You adjust your scale whne necessary to be able to show your projections all the way across to the right side of the screen.
If you are all up to date and sitting there what your screen is showing that most all other traders have never seen in their lives is THE FUTURE coming towards now bar after bar.
What you will notice most prominently is that the current bar NEVER goes off the bottom or the top of the screen.
You will continually notice that the future keeps changing. You are SEEING in advance where the future is in terms of price and volume. You have volume rays and some of the time they dissappear upward as the volume declines. This tells you that the price activity is narrowing as well and you will see this on your screen.
I try to keep the same scale on my price screen. This gives me a personal calibration. I usually have this because I have the right 1/3 blank and most of the time no scaling changes show up as a consequence.
The projections to the right side of the screen, being there at all times, help to stablize this scaling problem.
Put yourself in my place for a sec. Do you see that most of what I say over and over and over is not getting through in any way to almost anyone? you have seen others post about their 7 fractals etc.. They are saying the same thing too.
Think about the "hold" and "reverse" orientaion we have as opposed to entry and exits. You see over and over and over people tellling us the myths of entry, exit, stops, and target for edge that have "probabilities" SCT does not have entries, exits, stops, targets and probabilities. It is very spacey here in ET mentally.
SCT deals with the multiple envelopes of channels that show on 7 fractals. There are not 7 envelopes of channels. there are only the trditional economic boundaries of long term, intermediate term and short term. SCT uses a bunch of fractals to go to to start at the "outside" (think of an onion) and draw the envelopes of the LT, IT and ST as containers for where we make money.
we chose intraday trading because we have a mental capability to handle the high money velocity found there every day. It is "unbelievable to people who can not do the work to draw channels and think in the manner of SCT. Those who think in the logical manner of SCT can mo0nitor what they are set up to "SEE". They have acquired truths of the market ooperation. these are used consciously all the time to compare monitored data (including the observered relationship of NOW price to the projected channels moving form the future into NOW space. Monitoring lets you look at this future on the right side of your screen all the time. The future is kept the right size in the manner of projecting. The current trading bar sits still in the place it has on your screen. It does not walk off the screen periodically at this point in computer software design.
You can make a 5 min chart and a 2 min chart look identical in width of time on the screen by streching the 2 min or squeezing the 5 min. Thus you an see the same future on both.
A MAJOR key for making money is projecting the channels on the charts you monitor.
iIam suggesting that peole begin to see the future on their screeens by getting the current bar WELL OFF THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE SCREEN. I am suggesting that the space be filled up with something very important instead. That is all the projections that are possible, When the screen is adjusted to show the channel of the fastest fractal under consideration. LT and IT most poften do not show. sometimes ST does not show.
BUT when they do show it is part of the monitoring sweeping data set and it enters into the comaprison with known truths. SCT sees when home rune can be hit and just how far a homerun is going to be. SCT sees the ball park and the puttiing green at all times.
So go back and read what people say about putting the 7 fractals to work and how to draw the channels and their projections. this is how you get set up to begin to monitor for making money.
Post your results so the dream team can help you. Have I seen stalkers series of envelopes for his trading screen as yet? whose screen have been posted? we do not expect B people to post. When they do it is, at best a tredline maybe and certainly it is not projected and was always drawn after the fact. They cannot reason to do anything else. Trading is not a history class. Trading is like going to the war college in Carlyle PA or to school in NH for the state department or to school in Atlanta for CDC planning or to UCSC in Philly to get the EPA simulations. They all play several levels deep. We do too. We do the money game with LT, IT, and ST and we play in NOW with the future coming into the present. It is the opposite of predicting, betting protecting and targeting which is BS.
SCT is a comprehensive thing that is aligned to the truths of the market. Only a simple repeated routine is required to do four things: monitor, analyze, make decisions and act. Part of monitoring is setting up screens. The screens are annotated and calibrated according to the dictates of the markets.
now is the time to begin to set up your screen and annotate and monitor it.
stalker and his dad went back one step further. they considered getting screens and getting software that made the screens begin to work. There is no choice on this since there is no cost relatively speaking to do it. To go to a movie you buy a ticket.
For SCT the ticket price is working. Working with the proper screen set up, the proper annotations and the proper routine and the proper sweeping of the displays. If you have this, you get the truths of the market straight in no time.
This is not poker playing. It is just becoming more at one with the market and sharing responsibilities properly and not usurping any market responsibilities. The market is always right so don't mess with Mother Nature. Just get very rich instead.
we are not trying to be right; we are just front running the market.
Betting is trying to be right. Setting stops is trying to be right. Setting targets is trying to be right.
The market is capable of doing a lot of jobs for you; your job is to read the market and do accordingly. You have two jobs: "continue" and "reverse"; do both of which when you are told to. Both jobs are always done in the present and no other time.
I hope you see how having all this stuff in place continually does away with the debates on what the market is doing. Look around ET and see if you can find a time where there is no debate raging about the market status.
SCT has all of that in the bag and projected for the foreseeable future.
We have it out there for it ot come to us. We keep projecting it as an iterative refinement of what the future brings to NOW.
Our money making, seamlessly and continually keeps adjusting as the future comes to now.
We are sweeping the scene to the extent necessary. WE hold when price is traversing within the envelope(s). when we get to the edges (boundaries, we assess the end effects more and more finely to be able to decide to act. Then we act in a timely manner.
Obviously we have our "what wasn't that?" theme too. Where doe it come from? we sweep for complete data sets in repeated sequences. You can see as you read here every day the thoughts of a lot of people. you can see them looking at NOW quite nicely and you also see a little sneaky thought here and there about (this is not the best thing) what may be hoped for. Hoping ofr something isn't part od SCT. but there are common sequences that play out repeatedly (these aren't edges per se since they ocur during money making). So these things that are there by not being there come down to being what is needed to complete a data set that makes that data set something that can be used to make the decision at hand (usually a "hold" decision)
A what wasn't that? is simply a missing ingredient that would have made a commonly occurring Now data set most complete. Experience is most of all what tells you when data sets are complete.
The best way to get there is to keep the four parts spearate> Keep monitoring spearate from analysis and keep analysis separate from decision making. just sit in each separate compartment and do all that can be done in thqat compartment.
It is common for people to say "oh I didn't see that this time around". that is not what I mean. when a person missies something it is not a "what wasn't that" Missing things is the easiest way to miss "what wasn't thats".
so doing completeness in each compartment is what is called for. Strive to feel unsure until you have covered all the possibilities of the sweep path from the chart. go no further than you must, but go to the end point of the sweep. You will read "continue' so much you will not like continue except for knowing it means you are making more money as a consequence. When you get familiar with completing tasks of the compartments, then you get a feeling that is kind of like the feeling of drinking very pure mountain stream water when you find it along the trail. It is what you find because you hike to where it is found.
This place allows you to see what is missing when it is missing.
The market, as a rule wishes to continue along its way. Usually it is blocked in an unseen way by something that cannot be seen.
simple blocks are easiest to find indirectly by what isn't happening that could be. Compound blocks are more subtle but they can be appreciated.
As you run into these things by their lack of overt presence, you are already prepared on the trading platform any ways. your alternatives are to continue to make money after taking action of to just settle for profits and then make a later reentry once the market renews its activity.
One thing is for sure, you are operating. you are performing and what you are dealing with primarily is improving your effectiveness and efficiency. All of this experience builds parallel paths in your mind. Most of them are there too. you are simply adding additional wiring that lets you zig and zag a little more and faster than you did before.
I am posting to encourage you to take the experiences. If you see a "what wasn't that?" let the team know.
Look around Outside bars once in a while.
SCT has all of that in the bag and projected for the foreseeable future.
We have it out there for it ot come to us. We keep projecting it as an iterative refinement of what the future brings to NOW.
Our money making, seamlessly and continually keeps adjusting as the future comes to now.
We are sweeping the scene to the extent necessary. WE hold when price is traversing within the envelope(s). when we get to the edges (boundaries, we assess the end effects more and more finely to be able to decide to act. Then we act in a timely manner.
Obviously we have our "what wasn't that?" theme too. Where doe it come from? we sweep for complete data sets in repeated sequences. You can see as you read here every day the thoughts of a lot of people. you can see them looking at NOW quite nicely and you also see a little sneaky thought here and there about (this is not the best thing) what may be hoped for. Hoping ofr something isn't part od SCT. but there are common sequences that play out repeatedly (these aren't edges per se since they ocur during money making). So these things that are there by not being there come down to being what is needed to complete a data set that makes that data set something that can be used to make the decision at hand (usually a "hold" decision)
A what wasn't that? is simply a missing ingredient that would have made a commonly occurring Now data set most complete. Experience is most of all what tells you when data sets are complete.
The best way to get there is to keep the four parts spearate> Keep monitoring spearate from analysis and keep analysis separate from decision making. just sit in each separate compartment and do all that can be done in thqat compartment.
It is common for people to say "oh I didn't see that this time around". that is not what I mean. when a person missies something it is not a "what wasn't that" Missing things is the easiest way to miss "what wasn't thats".
so doing completeness in each compartment is what is called for. Strive to feel unsure until you have covered all the possibilities of the sweep path from the chart. go no further than you must, but go to the end point of the sweep. You will read "continue' so much you will not like continue except for knowing it means you are making more money as a consequence. When you get familiar with completing tasks of the compartments, then you get a feeling that is kind of like the feeling of drinking very pure mountain stream water when you find it along the trail. It is what you find because you hike to where it is found.
This place allows you to see what is missing when it is missing.
The market, as a rule wishes to continue along its way. Usually it is blocked in an unseen way by something that cannot be seen.
simple blocks are easiest to find indirectly by what isn't happening that could be. Compound blocks are more subtle but they can be appreciated.
As you run into these things by their lack of overt presence, you are already prepared on the trading platform any ways. your alternatives are to continue to make money after taking action of to just settle for profits and then make a later reentry once the market renews its activity.
One thing is for sure, you are operating. you are performing and what you are dealing with primarily is improving your effectiveness and efficiency. All of this experience builds parallel paths in your mind. Most of them are there too. you are simply adding additional wiring that lets you zig and zag a little more and faster than you did before.
I am posting to encourage you to take the experiences. If you see a "what wasn't that?" let the team know.
Look around Outside bars once in a while.
Quote from ETLURKER:
Yes similar to the tiki.
The formula is simply the sum of the last prices divided by the current divisor. see cbot for such info.
You can also monitor for arb programs knowing current fair mkt value and buy/sell areas. The web link you posted shows those.
The problem using IB's cash value for the DJIA is that it is delayed reporting and could give false str/squ thereby.
Its nice to clean up stuff and eliminate delays. And its noteworthy that there is always something to deal with. That is why God invented weekends. So we do need to spend them doing these things; why waste a weekend.
There are some more punchy things to do too.
This set is the one that gets you on board for making the better number of trades for a given day. Another set is the one that calibrates you for market pace; it could be called how hard to squeeze the rock. The slaloming drills are good too; here you learn that time is only worth so much if you read me. I like the set for dealing fearlessly, flawlessly and famously with trend overlapping.
These are all doublers of the daily take.
Here is what I mean as a stark contrast example. this guy would not use a left line; he would only exit on trend lines IF he thought suplly/demand piffle was in the space.
We are tuned in now so none of those factors are part of the puzzle they are all a priori necessities. You see that putting the left line in lets you get THE place where the next trend begins. you see the BO of a prior trendline is aftr the third confirmation of the new trend. you skip the "reading" of S and P as archaic by now.
So what are you doing to make punchy improvements in the next five areas you are considering?
Consider how doing more trades a day affects your money velocity. Consider how doing less trades a day affects your money velocitiy. Okay I have to be fair here. When do you start looking at trading more in the day and less in the day? you do see imediately when i state one thinkg it has another side. when you see both sides then you go to where the sides apply specifically instead of drawing carte blanche solutions.
This is all pace and volatility stuff.
To get more multiples of the daily H-L value, you ate some point have to look at the parts of the day. we see the W amd M patterns; four legs(or more, you now say and see) that really pay off. the high paced days you hold 'em. Omn more languid days of slower pace but still having volatility, you can step up to the line and go both ways on traverses. how do you do it from the start of the situation instead o catching on half way through the opportunity. Yes, looking at dtails like the stuff in bold at the top. so if you are looking at that stuff, do it form the viewpoint of how it can step up the harvest WITHIN the context of the day's current postings. So calibrate the paces where this stuff can let you play harder with more rewards.
Switching topics. There has been a lot of good talk in the time of trend overlap. Lets do our best to bag the new trend starts ASAP. What this does is make money twice for you: on the way out and on the way in. Talk it up.
I am totally in support of the way this thread is moving up as time passes.
There are incremental improvements that affect the percent per day of profits. We are talking inside the binomial of the compound interest formula. Along side that you can consider adding a few units to the daily exponent of the binomial. Both are important for steepening the difference between initial and final capital.
Tweak tweek.
http://www.dacharts.com/qtips-global/plot-delta-for-tick-range-volume-bars.htm
re prv, ensign users might be interested in this study which can graphically represent the time taken to form a specific vol bar on a constant vol chart
http://www.dacharts.org/archives/En...vol_bid_ask_spread_DYO_Alans_Box_07-06-05.htm
this study shows how to break down the bid ask volume, haven't tried to implement these yet as hectic at work
re prv, ensign users might be interested in this study which can graphically represent the time taken to form a specific vol bar on a constant vol chart
http://www.dacharts.org/archives/En...vol_bid_ask_spread_DYO_Alans_Box_07-06-05.htm
this study shows how to break down the bid ask volume, haven't tried to implement these yet as hectic at work
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