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Question for Grob/Hershey...
- Thread starter makosgu
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Quote from callmate:
I would be grateful if someone could say in a lay person's language what a rocket trade is. I have done some search but still not any wiser. Or please point me to a thread where I can explore the concept of a rocket trade.
Am I right in saying that a rocket trade has something to do with trading at peaks and valleys when stochastic/ MACD are at extremes?
Rockets have brought down many a trader. LOL. They are momentum trades, breakouts, usually at or near the high or low of the day. Volume will help to keep you out of trouble but many rockets fail. In fact I think more fizzle than blast off so you must cut your losses quickly, or, with practice, get out flat.(wash trades). I suggest extensive paper trading before risking any money.
p.s. It is really cool how the quick the links appear now.
I just read though this entire thread as well as the previous thread, the "Do Trendlines Work?" thread, and I've read most of the documents on the MSN group. I'm in the process of reading the 500 page thread from a couple years back, but I have some questions about drawing the channels.
This is beginner stuff, and it seems that many people don't post charts here anymore and are way past this level. If this doesn't belong here, I'll start a new thread.
Attached is a chart with my channels for the AM session. I will go through it bar by bar, and explain my reasoning for drawing them there. Tell me where I am right or wrong.
The first channel is drawn using the lows of bars 1 and 2 for points 1 and 3. The LTL is parallel to the RTL and point 2 is drawn from the high of bar 1.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 3, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the high of bar 2. Point 3 is the high of bar 3. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the low of bar 4.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 6 (could have been bar 7; hard to tell on the chart), so it's time to start drawing the next channel. This is where I get confused. What points do I use to draw the next channel? I used the low of bar 4 as point 1, and the low of bar 6 as point 3. Using the low of bar 4 as point 1 is clear to me. However, I could just have easily used the low of bar 5 as point 3 instead. Which is point 3 on your charts, the low of bar 5 or the low of bar 6? Anyway, the LTL for this channel was later adjusted so point 2 is the high of bar 5.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 9, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the high of bar 8. Point 3 is the high of bar 9. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the low of bar 10.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 12, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the low of bar 11. Point 3 is the low of bar 12. Point 2 is the high of bar 11.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 13, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. What separates this from every other channel I drew is that point 3 was not on the same bar that closed outside of the RTL of the previous channel. I had to wait until the close of bar 14 to draw point 3. Is this correct? So, point 1 is the high of bar 13. Point 3 is the high of bar 14. Point 2 is the low of bar 13.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 15, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the low of bar 13. Point 3 is the low of bar 14. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the high of bar 16.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 17, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the high of bar 16. Point 3 is the high of bar 17. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the low of bar 18.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 21, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the low of bar 20. Point 3 is the low of bar 21. Point 2 is the high of bar 21.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 22. This is another channel that could have been drawn 2 different ways. Points 1 and 3 could have been the highs of bars 21 and 22 with the low of bar 22 being point 2. I used the high of bars 22 and 23 for points 1 and 3. Was I correct?
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 28. Point 1 was the low of bar 28. Point 3 was the low of bar 29. Point 2 was the high of bar 28.
This is all I have for the AM session. Any feedback would be much appreciated.
This is beginner stuff, and it seems that many people don't post charts here anymore and are way past this level. If this doesn't belong here, I'll start a new thread.
Attached is a chart with my channels for the AM session. I will go through it bar by bar, and explain my reasoning for drawing them there. Tell me where I am right or wrong.
The first channel is drawn using the lows of bars 1 and 2 for points 1 and 3. The LTL is parallel to the RTL and point 2 is drawn from the high of bar 1.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 3, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the high of bar 2. Point 3 is the high of bar 3. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the low of bar 4.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 6 (could have been bar 7; hard to tell on the chart), so it's time to start drawing the next channel. This is where I get confused. What points do I use to draw the next channel? I used the low of bar 4 as point 1, and the low of bar 6 as point 3. Using the low of bar 4 as point 1 is clear to me. However, I could just have easily used the low of bar 5 as point 3 instead. Which is point 3 on your charts, the low of bar 5 or the low of bar 6? Anyway, the LTL for this channel was later adjusted so point 2 is the high of bar 5.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 9, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the high of bar 8. Point 3 is the high of bar 9. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the low of bar 10.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 12, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the low of bar 11. Point 3 is the low of bar 12. Point 2 is the high of bar 11.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 13, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. What separates this from every other channel I drew is that point 3 was not on the same bar that closed outside of the RTL of the previous channel. I had to wait until the close of bar 14 to draw point 3. Is this correct? So, point 1 is the high of bar 13. Point 3 is the high of bar 14. Point 2 is the low of bar 13.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 15, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the low of bar 13. Point 3 is the low of bar 14. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the high of bar 16.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 17, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the high of bar 16. Point 3 is the high of bar 17. The LTL was adjusted so point 2 is the low of bar 18.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 21, so it's time to start drawing the next channel. Point 1 is the low of bar 20. Point 3 is the low of bar 21. Point 2 is the high of bar 21.
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 22. This is another channel that could have been drawn 2 different ways. Points 1 and 3 could have been the highs of bars 21 and 22 with the low of bar 22 being point 2. I used the high of bars 22 and 23 for points 1 and 3. Was I correct?
Price closes outside of the RTL on bar 28. Point 1 was the low of bar 28. Point 3 was the low of bar 29. Point 2 was the high of bar 28.
This is all I have for the AM session. Any feedback would be much appreciated.
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Mak
no problem on name confusion - I deduced your comments were for me - appreciate your willingness to provide insight and feedback and everyone (excluding the clowns) on this thread benefits greatly from yours and Grob's insights -
txuk, myself and some others are working on bringing an entire picture to the table as Grob suggests and "have a record built of the solution(s) to the problems"
attached as requested is entire log for day based on FV of 55.09 (or 55 in your case as you indicated you would round to to commence the day). I marked the period requested in yellow in col E and the rows you need are lines 945 to line 1206 i.e. 11:10am to 12:11pm
so far all we have done is filter the extremes so e.g. 5 successive stretches without an interim neutral will show up with 1 time stamp of the largest stretch and 1 value of same. This may be limiting but is less hyper
You are gracious to suggest I have well thought out reasons on not showing volume etc. - consider me a lagging indicator, an Irish one at that so I'll add those to my chart also. The goal here is to do, present observations and learn from valued feedback
many thanks
IRL
no problem on name confusion - I deduced your comments were for me - appreciate your willingness to provide insight and feedback and everyone (excluding the clowns) on this thread benefits greatly from yours and Grob's insights -
txuk, myself and some others are working on bringing an entire picture to the table as Grob suggests and "have a record built of the solution(s) to the problems"
attached as requested is entire log for day based on FV of 55.09 (or 55 in your case as you indicated you would round to to commence the day). I marked the period requested in yellow in col E and the rows you need are lines 945 to line 1206 i.e. 11:10am to 12:11pm
Your log time looks good and perhaps you have found a better way to get rid of the sampling I had been experiencing when I had logging code tracking the offset.
so far all we have done is filter the extremes so e.g. 5 successive stretches without an interim neutral will show up with 1 time stamp of the largest stretch and 1 value of same. This may be limiting but is less hyper
I typically scale my DOM chart a bit more than you do but that is just a preference item. I do it to avoid feeling unnecessarily hyper. Additionally, I enable the pace setting and volume for each DOM bar. Again, this is just personal preference. As you can probably imagine, I have my reasons and I'm sure you have yours.
You are gracious to suggest I have well thought out reasons on not showing volume etc. - consider me a lagging indicator, an Irish one at that so I'll add those to my chart also. The goal here is to do, present observations and learn from valued feedback
many thanks
IRL
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Quote from emini_trades:
...
This is beginner stuff, and it seems that many people don't post charts here anymore and are way past this level. If this doesn't belong here, I'll start a new thread.
...
Hi emini -
I wouldn't say I'm way past this level, but I'll certainly comment on what I can. The first thing I would recommend is that you make your chart as big as possible - but not so big that it makes you "hyper." Grob recommends that you fill the screen with the bars as much as possible. I've got mine set to 2 pt scale, with 10 pts visible (ie each horizontal line is spaced 2 pts apart) Doing this also makes it easier for people to comment on your charts.
Leave about 1/3 of the chart on the right side blank. When you draw your trendlines in, draw them all the way to the edge of the chart.
Attached is a chart with my channels for the AM session. I will go through it bar by bar, and explain my reasoning for drawing them there. Tell me where I am right or wrong.
...
Unfortunately, I don't have time at the moment to go through all the channels. Some general things -
There was a carryover channel from yesterday, in which the first 10 or so bars rode in. You'll want to get these on your charts also.
At first glance it seems like most of your channels are good. As Mak pointed out to me awhile back, they are a coarse way of anticipating the market, so you can play fast and loose a bit.
Think about the PV relationship. Which leads? What would these two variables look like at pt 1? pt 2? pt 3?
Lastly - draw as many channels as you can - 5, 15, 30, and 60 min, daily, and weekly fractals. Draw them after the close. Draw them in realtime. Even if you aren't sure they are right, even if you think you did it wrong, even if you can't figure out how to draw part of it - eventually YOU WILL GET IT. Somehow the brain just begins to make the connections.
Oh - if you don't have the document here:
http://mithrilstudios.com/Articles/TemporaryRepository.html
which may be of use to you.
Sorry I can't be of more assistance atm - I'm out of time :/
Best Regards
Anthony
Quote from emini_trades:
This is beginner stuff....
We were all beginners too...
Some insights from a beginner tooâ¦.. First your channels are drawn as you see them appear, that is what is important. As suggested by others drawing plenty of them on each fractal will allow you to glean more and more, I could not agree more with this suggestion.
The most significant discovery I have recently had with channels is to realize that as each one forms knowing what can come next is very important, for example when you realize that channels exist as traverses of the next higher timeframe channel you see that you are heading somewhere and can expect to reach the bounds of the higher time frame and begin the next channel usually in the opposite direction. So as volume peaks and you are close to a higher fractals LTL/ RTL what can happen next? When channels are going, this is continuation, when something ceases from continuing the possibility of change should enter your picture. Some possibilities are FTT, BO, Formations following the TL you are on, etc. The most common formations are pennants, there are three its neat to see a symmetrical pennant riding the trendline. These are just my observations from a beginners view, if they help in anyway great, if not feel free to disregard.
This is like building a machine of sorts (your brain), there are many, many parts and pieces, just when you think you KNOW you find another whole pile of pieces that go somewhere. You begin by picking them up one at a time and examining them to see where they might fit (drills). You do however, have no missing parts, they are all here and putting them together takes time. As all of those involved here know, the assembly goes differently for everyone, but we can all learn from each other. Good luck and good trading to you.
EX
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