No, you go back to the account you were trading before. So if you had a 100k account and lost 5k your equity would be 95k when you go live again. Obviously you have to make back losses or you would be incentivized for getting kicked off the live account.
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Patak Trading
- Thread starter Dobbes
- Start date
No, you go back to the account you were trading before. So if you had a 100k account and lost 5k your equity would be 95k when you go live again. Obviously you have to make back losses or you would be incentivized for getting kicked off the live account.
Quote from NDJeff02:
I think everyone is getting too hung up on the issue of the account size (i.e. $50K, $100K, etc). Think of it more in terms of buying power. With the $50K account you can trade up to 5 lots, so that's your buying power. In reality you'd need a good profit cushion to do 5 lots since the most you're allowed to lose in a day with that account size is $1K.
Right. I basically have explained to guys that the account value is roughly equivalent to the over night margin requirements for the maximum position size you can hold. So for example, the overnight margin in gold is 9k I believe, let's call it 10k. A 100k account you can trade a max of 10 lots. Assuming you trade the contract with the highest margin, gold, that would be 10 contracts times 10k or 100k. The way I like to look at is you have one million in notional buying power. Since margins change, the notional value stays the same so it's a more consistent way of looking at what you are trading.
Quote from Maverick74:
No, you go back to the account you were trading before. So if you had a 100k account and lost 5k your equity would be 95k when you go live again. Obviously you have to make back losses or you would be incentivized for getting kicked off the live account.
They make money on commissions ?
Do you have to trade, lets say I stay flat for 3-4 days in a row ?
Quote from Maverick74:
Right. I basically have explained to guys that the account value is roughly equivalent to the over night margin requirements for the maximum position size you can hold. So for example, the overnight margin in gold is 9k I believe, let's call it 10k. A 100k account you can trade a max of 10 lots. Assuming you trade the contract with the highest margin, gold, that would be 10 contracts times 10k or 100k. The way I like to look at is you have one million in notional buying power. Since margins change, the notional value stays the same so it's a more consistent way of looking at what you are trading.
"The way I like to look at is you have one million in notional buying power."....I think this may leave traders under-capitalized. Buy 1 two-year note and think you control $100,000+?" Fine, but that's not reality. The reality is, How much can I make versus risk versus overnight margin versus drawdown.....
If you don't have 100k, don't count on trading as a full-time gig.
And don't tell me you can turn 50k into 100k in a year......lol
If you are over 30, you should strive to make a minimum of 50k a year, with hopes of 75k trading and then more for bonus. And you will not do that with a 10k account, or a notional account of 1 million.
Quote from optionbull:
They make money on commissions ?
Do you have to trade, lets say I stay flat for 3-4 days in a row ?
Nope. Once you go live you can trade as little or as much as you like. Even in the combine what they let you do is pick the days you want to trade which I think is VERY beneficial for new traders. So for example. If you do a 20 day combine, you have 60 days to complete it. So you can pick any 20 days in that 60 day period to trade. Maybe you hate trading on Fridays or Mondays. Maybe you hate fed days or oil inventory days. There really are very little excuses a trader can make.
Quote from BlueTurtle:
"The way I like to look at is you have one million in notional buying power."....I think this may leave traders under-capitalized. Buy 1 two-year note and think you control $100,000+?" Fine, but that's not reality. The reality is, How much can I make versus risk versus overnight margin versus drawdown.....
If you don't have 100k, don't count on trading as a full-time gig.
And don't tell me you can turn 50k into 100k in a year......lol
If you are over 30, you should strive to make a minimum of 50k a year, with hopes of 75k trading and then more for bonus. And you will not do that with a 10k account, or a notional account of 1 million.
I agree. Which is why I laugh at those who think they can just open a 2k account and make a go at it. This game requires capital and 5k to 10k at IB or AMP is not going to cut it. I've been saying that on this forum since 2002. Not many people listen though.
Quote from NDJeff02:
I think everyone is getting too hung up on the issue of the account size (i.e. $50K, $100K, etc). Think of it more in terms of buying power. With the $50K account you can trade up to 5 lots, so that's your buying power. In reality you'd need a good profit cushion to do 5 lots since the most you're allowed to lose in a day with that account size is $1K.
No doubt. The only problem is that your Kelly criterion is prob higher on the open and position sizing math dictates bigger size when you have a higher probability setup. So if you are "trading the money" and increasing bet size as you make money, you may be shooting yourself in the foot. Really you should trade bigger in the morning and smaller in chop...
I'm assuming the trading day starts at midnight EDT for TST purposes or does it start after the first trade? That would make sense for folks in Asia or wherever.
Quote from Maverick74:
Regarding the 48 live traders, that IS actually the number of traders currently live. If you go to the site and go to their profile, they have an "L" badge which designates being live.
It is NOT the number of traders who are currently Live. My friend went Live but got booted and is no longer trading with them. He did get funded though.
I'm not arguing with you as you are absolutely correct in that it is a decent opportunity for people who need it. And like you said we'll see how many of those "Live" traders stay with them after 6 months. Trading is a tough gig.
Quote from mistermarket:
It is NOT the number of traders who are currently Live. My friend went Live but got booted and is no longer trading with them. He did get funded though.
I'm not arguing with you as you are absolutely correct in that it is a decent opportunity for people who need it. And like you said we'll see how many of those "Live" traders stay with them after 6 months. Trading is a tough gig.
I maybe wrong but once a trader is no longer live, they no longer have an "L" badge. I see 47 "live" badges right now.
http://www.topsteptrader.com/Profiles/2
Honestly, there could be more because there are people who have gotten funded in the last two weeks who I don't see on there. So perhaps this is not being updated in real time. But I get 3 to 4 notifications a week from these guys when they fund a new account. That's about 15 a month. Not hard to get up to 45 considering they have been doing this for several years now.
Patriciap1 is on there, and she was just funded yesterday so I bet those traders already got booted LOL. Here they are, we can check back in 6 months and see if Maverick is correct...
1 albertli
2 alexvish
3 allonblack1
4 benihana1
5 bjorn
6 bofason
7 brookesjd9
8 burke
9 cgrosvenor
10 crt
11 cvlenz
12 domingo
13 fifthwave
14 flipper
15 forextrader
16 gmiller129
17 henry
18 ian
19 irishbk84
20 jamesbond
21 jcox
22 jderd
23 jj0322xx
24 jonbud
25 kjun
26 lancer
27 ljm72575
28 loneranger
29 marketmaker
30 marketqb
31 mavin
32 maykur
33 mlohrstl
34 mvelten
35 patriciap1
36 rex
37 ron
38 ryko1249
39 ryuken
40 santiago
41 scotty
42 setandforget
43 ss213
44 traderdg
45 usatrader
46 vision trader
47 waves6098
1 albertli
2 alexvish
3 allonblack1
4 benihana1
5 bjorn
6 bofason
7 brookesjd9
8 burke
9 cgrosvenor
10 crt
11 cvlenz
12 domingo
13 fifthwave
14 flipper
15 forextrader
16 gmiller129
17 henry
18 ian
19 irishbk84
20 jamesbond
21 jcox
22 jderd
23 jj0322xx
24 jonbud
25 kjun
26 lancer
27 ljm72575
28 loneranger
29 marketmaker
30 marketqb
31 mavin
32 maykur
33 mlohrstl
34 mvelten
35 patriciap1
36 rex
37 ron
38 ryko1249
39 ryuken
40 santiago
41 scotty
42 setandforget
43 ss213
44 traderdg
45 usatrader
46 vision trader
47 waves6098