There's very little text to be found on NOT T2's and NOT NOT T2's. They are said to deal with sub-fractal moves, so I suspect they may be countermoves to the expected move as according to the idealized Pattern. So unless we find something more concrete, we might have to invent them, if required. Maybe the right question for purposeful research would be: How to know to stay HOLD in the last legs of Trend Type D? Though, not sure if that's really preferable unless one zooms down in granularity.
On 10-case geometry and beyond
- Thread starter Simples
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I have no knowledge of, or any information about NOT T2's or NOT NOT anythings. The later reminds me of WWT (what wasn't that). Anyway...
The VTP and EE identification as a whole, represent a structure. EE identification is dependent on VTP being performed, although EE identification is not a requisite for performing VTP. In fact, VTP is a standalone piece, with no additional pieces necessary to be carried out, or for the result to be usable.
VTP is performed with no knowledge of or association with bands. The VTP is the VTP.
The VTP and EE identification as a whole, represent a structure. EE identification is dependent on VTP being performed, although EE identification is not a requisite for performing VTP. In fact, VTP is a standalone piece, with no additional pieces necessary to be carried out, or for the result to be usable.
VTP is performed with no knowledge of or association with bands. The VTP is the VTP.
The drift trends are great. Once an a turn is correctly ID'd then one knows a b turn is the only turn that is possible and can position accordingly. Those and 'quickies' are just simple and easy money makers to the disbelief of any not applying the method. The rainmakers are the trends that build progressively from Set A to B to C to D. It's a glorious thing to experience.
When I was coupling turns to the basic granularity of increasing and decreasing volume,
https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/why-does-ta-not-work-for-you.247024/page-102#post-3597689
In the above thread there is a good exchange between @frenchfry and Jack. From page 102ish and on, Jack walks through bar by bar and bridges the gap between SCT and RDBMS. There is text that describes not T2P as well as P3F and P3P.
There might be more content prior to page 102ish, that's just as far as I went back after getting a hit on a search phrase.
It's beneficial to place on ignore (if only temporarily) all others posters to get to the meat of it. Even some of the more well-respected posters. You'll be glad you did, it's just noise anyway as it applies to this study. Jack posts one of the first logs that I've found for RDBMS here.
NB #1190
Reading these buried posts are like treasure hunting. I've come away with some gems and perhaps others might benefit as well.
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Thanks. Don't think I've seen that thread before. If you want to filter users, you can "search this thread only" and select by usernames, if that helps enough. 165 becomes about 6 pages for "jack hershey". #1190 confirms new P1 after P2 and P2 after the T2's as well. The logic for VTP is clear in the volume elements table. It is interesting for T2-P3 that T2P has a dual role, as it covers first DV, then IV.
Thank you for the suggestion, that is very useful, there’s a lot of commentary prior to page 102ish.
I’m on the hunt for the original post of the hatetorisk pic. Another interesting attachment in that thread is Jack’s study on random coin tosses and how they follow ‘the pattern’
I've been taking some B-turns live (given enough range) and I have to say it's been working despite my lack of ability to spot the turn intra bar. Now that's been getting me somewhere around 2-3 trades per day and I do exit some ticks early but making anything in this low volatility for me is something new. I have to see how it goes few weeks more to be sure I really am getting it but looking good so far. Nowhere close to taking multiples of ATR but I take what I can. Thank you for helping me get this far! I feel like I see some light at the end of the tunnel.
Be confident, that light at the end of the tunnel leads to a different world, quite literally. The material keeps building the differentiation process in your mind. Something that helps to accelerate the process is to move into hold/reverse quickly. At first it might suck, so it's prudent to sim it, until one gains confidence. Hold/reverse is a vastly different mentality than TP/SL on the 5m. The 30m works in combo and is essential for keeping attention on the TF and having hold thrus be a relaxing activity and less reactional.
Be diligent in putting folks on ignore, the doubt that they introduce can be counter-productive before one gets to the tipping point of 'seeing' the market. Like attempting to assist a drowning person, one needs to keep the priorities straight and have safe and supportive boundaries. What is especially illuminating is seeing the past posts of some active members whom had the extreme fortune of interacting with Jack on a personal basis and did not. On the most part they are still floundering and all they desire is to pull others down than lift themselves up. I'm quite shocked that some of these folks have been here since Jack first introduced his concepts back in 2003. No change = no change.
Beliefs are powerful and do provide a opt-out for those with irreversable closed minds.
I should have listened to that advice before getting involved with some of the recent troll threads.
Keeping working, it'll all lead to -> Ka-ching!
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at some point, you'll prolly have to change your userid to NeedtoTeach
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Realizations, AHAs of one may be confusing and misunderstood by others not seeing the same, at that particular point in time though - AND vica versa!
Be confident, that light at the end of the tunnel leads to a different world, quite literally. The material keeps building the differentiation process in your mind. Something that helps to accelerate the process is to move into hold/reverse quickly. At first it might suck, so it's prudent to sim it, until one gains confidence. Hold/reverse is a vastly different mentality than TP/SL on the 5m. The 30m works in combo and is essential for keeping attention on the TF and having hold thrus be a relaxing activity and less reactional.
Be diligent in putting folks on ignore, the doubt that they introduce can be counter-productive before one gets to the tipping point of 'seeing' the market. Like attempting to assist a drowning person, one needs to keep the priorities straight and have safe and supportive boundaries. What is especially illuminating is seeing the past posts of some active members whom had the extreme fortune of interacting with Jack on a personal basis and did not. On the most part they are still floundering and all they desire is to pull others down than lift themselves up. I'm quite shocked that some of these folks have been here since Jack first introduced his concepts back in 2003. No change = no change.
Beliefs are powerful and do provide a opt-out for those with irreversable closed minds.
I should have listened to that advice before getting involved with some of the recent troll threads.
Keeping working, it'll all lead to -> Ka-ching!
edit:
at some point, you'll prolly have to change your userid to NeedtoTeach
LOL hopefully I'll get to that point sooner rather than later.
I'm still using sim to try hold/reverse here and there for C turns but I still need to differentiate my mind more for that it seems. It's tough to see C to C turns happen quickly and in increasing volatility which can put me in a deep drawdown before EOB. Some turns look rather obvious so I take those live for now and all else sim or just MADA.
Nice to see an ongoing discussion of Jack's work.
Is this the post you seek?
https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/the-markets-have-a-plan-but.245660/page-2#post-3569985
-river