Nov Shameless Self Promoting Guru Journal

[Te']

Quote from OldTrader:



What could you possibly learn from a journal of mine? I don't trade with a one or two point risk....and THAT wouldn't be "comfortable" for you would it?

OldTrader

There is only ONE way to play this game and it is NOT the "right" way nor the "wrong" way -----> it is HER WAY!

Trader must bend their internal world inorder to meet their outer, anything less and she will crush them!

OldTrader, you speak much truth with your words and even if I were not an experienced trader who has enjoyed much success in this game -- all I would need to know would be the imbalance of traders thrown up in arms. We play a 'losers' game right? I think this would be good fade; as is EliteTrader as a whole...


PEACE and good-trading

 

[OldTrader]

Quote from dottom:


For someone who doesn't understand the fundamentals of how ATR affects probability of price movement, and hence affects probability of stop loss or profit target being reached, you sure are quick to condemn it.


Have you ever walked into a prop firm before? Ask them how many of their best traders every take more than 1-2x ATR losses on trades... now ask how many of them make > $500k. What other proof do you need?

Just re-read my comments....I think I explained in full WHY I had a problem with setting a stop that tight. I don't think I "condemned" it though...kind of a strong word isn't it?

As far as a prop firm goes, never walked into one. But I would imagine that they would support what you're saying since you bring it up. The fact that prop traders agree with you does not change my opinion....but believe me, I'm not saying it's wrong for you or your type of trading, or for a prop trader.

You know...I wonder if some of the great speculators traded with a stop like that? George Soros? Richard Dennis?

OldTrader

 

[nitro]

Quote from OldTrader:



From Brandon's initial posts he had made a trade from a bear flag on a one minute chart....so I gathered from this that this must be one of his setups. But when I look at Fridays one minute chart, I see flags all over it. I probably misunderstood....
OldTrader

LOL

nitro

 

[nitro]

Quote from OldTrader:



From Brandon's initial posts he had made a trade from a bear flag on a one minute chart....so I gathered from this that this must be one of his setups. But when I look at Fridays one minute chart, I see flags all over it. I probably misunderstood.

I don't know if you were referring to me specifically in terms of "enter/exit on feel", but if you were, I'd like to clarify. I don't base my trading on "feel". I am a discretionary trader. But I look for reasons to make my trades....they just aren't flags on intraday charts...they are more apt to be based on the price action of certain key stocks/sectors, tick, trin, advance/decline, or market response to news....some of that type.

OldTrader

Old,

I am looking at myself in the mirror - We only differ in one way - I don't have the patience nor the stomach for the longer moves. I "wish" I did...

nitro

 

[nitro]

Quote from dbphoenix:



I assume you don't know who Brandon is. While his approach doesn't appeal to me, he's good enough to have made it into the Market Wizard category. Can you say the same?

--Db

What's a Market Wizard? You mean the people in Schwager's books?

nitro

 

[monee]

Oldtrader I have found your posts very interesting and helpful.

My setups I trade are similar to some of yours,but sometimes my discipline is weak.I realize having discipline weak sometimes is like being a little bit pregnant.
Many days I have caught an intraday reversal and bought within a point or 2 of the low and made 4 points only to see the mkt go 20.
What I have done now is after getting my fill and placing my stop, I will set an alarm for a target and my stop and leave the room ,and return only if the alarm is going off or its 3:55. More often than not this works better.
Interesting to come back later and see how es moved 3 points from my entry and went all the way back to my entry and then took off for the real move.Looking at the chart I know that if I had been in front of the computer I would have taken a tiny gain and missed the real move.
If I recall correctly in a previous post of yours you mention that you use limit orders to enter the mkt.I'm wondering if having them in would eliminate some of the emotional weakness in my trading.It does seem like the human brain is more important in the entry so one should be sitting in front of the screen,where as the human element in the exit can be a negative point ,since most times es will do all kinds of things before it reaches the target.
My question for you is how do you deal with discipline lapses,
or after 35 years of trading have you overcome this weakness and discipline comes second nature?
Thanks again for your insiteful posts.

Monee

 

[dottom]

Quote from OldTrader:
You know...I wonder if some of the great speculators traded with a stop like that? George Soros? Richard Dennis?

Invalid argument because the size/goals that Soros and Dennis were trading with were much larger than the day trading style I am referring to. Also, 99.999+% of ET readers would never encounter the liquidty/size contraints that Soros and Dennis would encounter.

You reach a practical limit with liquidity/slippage when trading on short-time frames. Now maybe $500k-1M/yr isn't the same level as Soros or Dennis, but it's a mighty nice living. Also, I guarantee you that I've outperformed Soros and Dennis on return-on-risk. Same can be said of many prop traders I personally know.

One of the benefits of a good short-term trading method is that it has very small drawdowns. How many times did Soros or Dennis have to look at themselves in the mirror with a 50% drawdown? Heck, I couldn't even imagine staring at a 30% drawdown these days (and I used to be a long-term trend follower and took Russell Sands course).

 

[Magna]

Quote from OldTrader:
You know...I wonder if some of the great speculators traded with a stop like that? George Soros? Richard Dennis?

And to follow up dottom's comments, obviously if you want to make billions you would need to model yourself after the great speculators. Those boys certainly didn't try to grab 3 pts out of the S&P eminis market. But the flipside is this, for the overwhelming majority of people who have no interest (or stomach) in making hundreds of millions, if you can consistently take a paltry 3 pts average out of the ES on a daily basis, and can bring yourself to trade a meager 3 contracts, that comes out to $112,500 per year (minus commissions). Not pocket change, better than many professions, and enough to live quite well in most places. So there's no point in taking the black 'n white view that either you should be trading like Soros or you shouldn't be trading.

 

[mezzanine]

Quote from OldTrader:



What could you possibly learn from a journal of mine? I don't trade with a one or two point risk....and THAT wouldn't be "comfortable" for you would it?

OldTrader

It would be really great if you did a journal. I've printed out most of your posts; learned more than I have from any book. If you did choose to do a journal, even just playing with it sporadically, it would be beneficial to many I'm sure. Please give that idea some consideration!

 

[Sucker]

Quote from OldTrader:

I am a discretionary trader. But I look for reasons to make my trades....they just aren't flags on intraday charts...they are more apt to be based on the price action of certain key stocks/sectors, tick, trin, advance/decline, or market response to news....some of that type.

OldTrader

Different sizes suit different strategies. He who trades size is trading trends in the big picture... to reach a comfortable level?