Niederhoffer In Trouble..... Again !!

[asiaprop]

I guess you got that right, in comparison to Buffet, Soros, Cohen, Shaw, Simons, Loeb, VN is just a cheap shot. He is the one who behaved as if he belonged to the big league yet he broke more often than any other whale. I see everyone else tight in the saddle, just VN sniffing around to figure out what else he can auction off.

Who am I in comparison? I never claimed to be the big guy, I make decent money, I am confident and I am highly ethical and pursue a morally upright life style. I can admit mistakes, I have done so numerous times also on ET. I just cannot stand bullshit and ass clowns who went broke numerous times and each time wipe the shix off their face, stand up, and tell everyone what great managers they are.

VN had his chances, he fuxxed up, he chose to run such risk, I think its time for him to retire and admit that in the end he did not manage the game of trading. Same with J. Livermore, I am sure he had his great moments in life, in the end he could not handle going from the top to the bottom over and over again, I dont think thats great trading. Nor is it great poker playing to make 30 million over several years only to lose all and then some soon after. Those are cowboy allures nothing else.

It does not matter how much you made in between, all it matters is how much you have made for yourself AND everyone around you, whom you managed money for, AT THE TIME when you close the book and retire.

Quote from Random.Capital:

Well that's clearly not true, as you are a nobody who as accomplished nothing, yet all you do on ET is praise yourself either directly, or indirectly by taking comparison-cheap-shots at others.

Pot, kettle, etc.

 

[fkbsuhites]

Not sure why ET is back to "Vic Bashing". His strategy of shorting Puts is a valid one since markets move higher in the long run.

His problem is he does not believe in Trends. As such his systems are unable to identify major tops and prolonged downtrends. If I provided him my trend analysis bots his strategy could easily make Billions by shutting off the Put selling at the trend tops and turning on Call selling in the downtrends.

 

[Rodney King]

Quote from asiaprop:

Taleb has never been considered a highly talented trader, never has he been portrayed as such either.

"Nassim Taleb, an option arbitrage pioneer, has closed 200,000 option trading tickets" -- from the jacket blurb of his first book. The "200,000 tickets" bit is repeated in his Preface. Go look it up.

 

[asiaprop]

and? Funny he never mentioned he made a penny on those trades when he was a floor trader in Paris.

Quote from Rodney King:

"Nassim Taleb, an option arbitrage pioneer, has closed 200,000 option trading tickets" -- from the jacket blurb of his first book. The "200,000 tickets" bit is repeated in his Preface. Go look it up.

 

[asiaprop]

I recommend you call him up, you both would make a great couple!

Quote from fkbsuhites:

Not sure why ET is back to "Vic Bashing". His strategy of shorting Puts is a valid one since markets move higher in the long run.

His problem is he does not believe in Trends. As such his systems are unable to identify major tops and prolonged downtrends. If I provided him my trend analysis bots his strategy could easily make Billions by shutting off the Put selling at the trend tops and turning on Call selling in the downtrends.

 

[Pekelo]

Quote from TraDaToR, when talking to 1outer...:

Thoreau, if you want to restore a bit of credibility , tell us exactly how much you lost for your investors over the years.

You are mixing them up, so again:

Thoreau = Victor

1outer... = Surf

It is rather easy to recognize Surfy, because he always comes with the "he was paid to make outsized returns" BS and he has a brown nose...

By the way both of them post from behind proxy servers, so the IP addresses can not be recognized.

 

[thoreau777]

Quote from Gabfly1:

Not to mention hundred-year-old books and LoBagola's elephants.

Gabfly1,

That was an ignorant comment don't you think? It greatly oversimplifies Victor's trading algorithms. Your assaults against Victor continue like salt rubbed into an open sore. But why? I am a mature man now.

As I continue to read and peruse your comments, I am starting to seethe with a starting scintilla of rage.

I am beginning to think your "sense of humor" and unfettered vitriol hurdled at a champion money manager manifests your own insecurities and inadequacies in your own trading prowess?

You must have gone through a very difficult period in your life recently. No one can exhort that which you do if they do not have misery in their heart. Nothing can come from the outside, which is not in existence on the inside.

Victor just celebrated the fourth birthday of his son, Aubrey. He is a happy man, and does not to be labored as such. I ask you to read the book, "Meditations" by Marcus Aurelius to gain a deeper sense of peace within yourself.

T

 

[thoreau777]

Quote from asiaprop:

you still dont get it. You are absolutely right, you can do that as much as you like with your own funds, and you can also shoot for the big stars as hedge fund or bank salaried trader until you either hit the lottery or get your ass fired, but its highly unethical plus a testimony to the inability to generate alpha when blowing up 3 times by taking outrageous risks and after completely failing as prudent risk manager when managing money for other individuals. As someone else put it earlier, you misunderstand something: Most investors are very keen to have at least their initial investments returned, no matter what risk you take. As prudent risk taker you build your p&l slowly before you increase risk, that is something I have learned from my first sell-side trading position onwards. VN went in full throttle and that three times, and three times he blew up big time. It does not matter what wealth he built for himself on the side, because all it means is that he gamed the system. He took outrageous risks, collected couple times, and the other times he ran away while his investors has to pick up the couple dimes on the dollar they invested. If my memory serves me right then I recall that VN promised to make whole each and every one of his investors. Isnt it funny he is still sitting in the Hamptons while his investors are still waiting?

You utterly confuse the special fiduciary responsibilities you undertake when managing others' finances with cowboy attitudes that you can employ when running your own savings or play big boy for a bank (others there make sure your ass gets kicked out a lot earlier than when VN closed his doors).

Victor has not "closed his doors".

 

[thoreau777]

Quote from TraDaToR:

Sorry, I meant for him AND his investors, excluding management fees...Trading results you know.... No way it's a positive number...

I will be very brief here. Please allow me a few very succinct words. I am somewhat familiar with this matter. Victor and his team has netted millions upon millions for his investors net of all fees across all funds over his investing career. I was alerted to this website from several contributors www.dailyspeculations.com and feel that Victor should be vindicated. However, I sense that the forthcoming few words would be wasted.

Victor does not purely sell OTM puts recklessly without hedging. I have no idea how this ridiculous rumor got started. Do you think the likes of George Soros and Morgan Stanley would invest and then extend unsecured lines of credit into the tens of millions of dollars to an unproven trading strategy with a novice? How can I put this matter to rest? Victor and his team has their brains everywhere and in most all financial instruments, not just OTM puts.

Also, where is the rumor that Victor completely "blew up" over and over? That is completely false. Utterly untrue. It is true that heavy losses were sustained in a few years out of over 40+ years of very consistent outrageous gains. Investors did not completely "lose their shirt" during the few rather unfortunate years. And who did NOT suffer during the years that Victor had his challenges? It is true Victor suffered heavy losses, but consider LTCM's complete blow up. Even George Soros had to close his Quantum Fund due to heavy losses as well. Other famed hedge fund managers like Richard Dennis, Larry Williams, and Jimmy Rogers endured similar lean years. Yes, some of Victor's funds were closed, but this was no different than other comparable hedge funds during that time period.

The difference was that Victor's funds had a much more consistent track record of superior gains for a far longer period. Can anyone here that must feel some need to criticize Victor produce a comparable sterling record? How dare you all.

It is well documented that Victor's well publicized rather difficult period in 1997 was caused by several financial institutions that conspired to "lynch" him together, as well as the market forces that eventually brought the Russian markets and the Asian markets to its knees. I still think that the crash of Oct. 27, 1997, was basically due to brokers running Victor's positions against him, knowing that he was on the ropes. The market had its greatest drop in the previous 10 years that day. And then the next day, once they were able to force me out, they rallied the markets.

The other difficult periods like in September 11th 2001 found its Aurora in unprecedented events that really cannot easily be mitigated with insurance.

I challenge any of the loathsome naysayers to even come close to replicating Victor's P/L over any rolling ten year period (which was a real time audited record). Sure there were difficult years... just a few to be fair to him. And when he faltered, even the likes of Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley and AIG and Lehman Brothers suffered concomittantly.

I present the evidence as directly as possible. I am about to give up endeavoring to alleviate complete and utter moronic drivel. Albert Einstein once wrote, "There are only two things possibly infinite: the universe and a man's stupidity, and I am not as altogether sure of the former, as I am of the latter".

 

[thoreau777]

Quote from Gabfly1:

Gabfly,

That cartoon was a feeble attempt at humor. Not funny at all. Your intellect is left wanting. Are you a 14 year old pimple faced newbie playing with your father's E-Trade account?