Amen.
Lupus patients are not getting sick from CCP virus
- Thread starter Buy1Sell2
- Start date
Your post about no elective procedures, is a repeat and irrelevant to my point...
The context of this is that "experts" and the press were telling us there was going to such a shortage of beds in San Diego they were going to be making "tent" hospitals by now.
Yet... right now and for quite a bit of time some of our hospitals are half empty and the some of the hosptials are laying off staff and/or cutting other pay.
I am not disputing that there is a reason half the floors are empty
I am telling you they told us they were going have to have people in tents by now and those projections turned out to be terrible projections.
Just do google search if you don't me about the projected need for field hospitals.
By the way, this was your insult...
"It is amusing to see clowns trying to claim there is no pandemic because the hospital visitor parking lot is empty." That was an insult.
I never claimed there was no pandemic. I am concerned the response to the pandemic should have been customized to each location. Total shutdown of the entire country at once was too extreme a measure. Opinions may differ. No one can really know.
Covid may be highly infections... but its clearly not doing as much damage to some demos as others.
Do you now acknowledge that San Diego only having 45 deaths by now is striking. And the idea that the shutdown worked.... Does not apply because were still be socials distancing shamed until a few weeks ago.
The context of this is that "experts" and the press were telling us there was going to such a shortage of beds in San Diego they were going to be making "tent" hospitals by now.
Yet... right now and for quite a bit of time some of our hospitals are half empty and the some of the hosptials are laying off staff and/or cutting other pay.
I am not disputing that there is a reason half the floors are empty
I am telling you they told us they were going have to have people in tents by now and those projections turned out to be terrible projections.
Just do google search if you don't me about the projected need for field hospitals.
By the way, this was your insult...
"It is amusing to see clowns trying to claim there is no pandemic because the hospital visitor parking lot is empty." That was an insult.
I never claimed there was no pandemic. I am concerned the response to the pandemic should have been customized to each location. Total shutdown of the entire country at once was too extreme a measure. Opinions may differ. No one can really know.
Covid may be highly infections... but its clearly not doing as much damage to some demos as others.
Do you now acknowledge that San Diego only having 45 deaths by now is striking. And the idea that the shutdown worked.... Does not apply because were still be socials distancing shamed until a few weeks ago.
Last edited:
So let me ask... there are numerous videos out there making claims that there is no pandemic because the hospital visitor lot was empty. They claim the hospital visitor lot would be full if there was a pandemic. Of course, they completely ignore that no visitors are allowed in the hospital whatsoever which is why the hospital visitor lot was empty. Anyone posting or promoting these videos should be considered a "clown".
If you take this pointing out of the obvious as an "insult" then the problem is with your perception rather than my commentary.
There can be a discussion about the appropriate response to the pandemic, and if the U.S. responded appropriately. But the starting point of an reasonable conversation MUST BE THE FACTS. What I listed was the facts; it was not "spin". If you are not willing to start with the facts then obviously no reasonable discussion can be held.
The cities in California had a much earlier and better response than the rest of the U.S. including San Francisco and San Diego. California had the first state-wide stay at home order on March 19th. In context of this their lower number of deaths and cases is not striking - but more akin to other countries that responded quickly and appropriately like South Korea and Germany.
you quoted me when you responded.
if you did not want me to take it that way... you should have said so.
your facts were irrelevant to the discussion.
We already knew the reason why they were shutting down.
The amazing thing was the context.
We were not supposed to have to shut down. We were supposed to be so overwhelmed we needed tent hospitals.
I really have no need to debate you on this.
You are going to say the shutdown worked.
And I am going to say if you think dynamically and understand we are significantly... might I say massively under projections most everywhere at the moment.
It could be due to the shutdown or it could be do to massively wrong projections.
Probably a bit of both.
No one is going to be able to identify the exact percentage of each for weeks or months, if ever.
if you did not want me to take it that way... you should have said so.
your facts were irrelevant to the discussion.
We already knew the reason why they were shutting down.
The amazing thing was the context.
We were not supposed to have to shut down. We were supposed to be so overwhelmed we needed tent hospitals.
I really have no need to debate you on this.
You are going to say the shutdown worked.
And I am going to say if you think dynamically and understand we are significantly... might I say massively under projections most everywhere at the moment.
It could be due to the shutdown or it could be do to massively wrong projections.
Probably a bit of both.
No one is going to be able to identify the exact percentage of each for weeks or months, if ever.
So you live in a place that started stay-at-home first in the U.S. on a state-wide basis. You should be happy that you live in a state that started this early and therefore saw minimal cases compared to the U.S. hot-spots. California is an obvious example of "the shutdown worked". The only reason most places in the U.S. are not overwhelmed and using tents is because shut-downs worked to "flatten the curve". Be happy that actions worked to massively lower the projections.
I will note the projections for various scenarios very much matched the University of Washington modeling & projections. Be happy many states in the U.S. chose the path to avoid needing tent hospitals and being overwhelmed.
The question now become how and when do you open the U.S. back up. This is primarily controlled by governors who should be provided with firm federal guidance. I expect the best path is to open up regionally and carefully look for outbreaks. If an outbreak occurs then it is back to "stay at home" for the state/region. But this all requires much better testing & monitoring than we have right now.
The additional thought on opening is that it should be in multiple steps; first open businesses such as restaurants, then open schools, then allow large events. It should be done in steps that scale up - if an outbreak occurs in a state then it can be scaled back (for example no more large events because of increased COVID-19 cases this week).
I/we should consider all the factors when I/we decide if we should be happy about this total shutdown.
Have you seen what that Dr. Burry guy from the big short had to say about this shutdown?
Just to let you know... not everyone agrees with you...
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...s-virus-lockdowns-in-controversial-tweetstorm
"Prudent plan: 1) Standardize on chloroquine and azithromycin -cheap and available 2) Sick and elderly voluntarily shelter in place. 3) Americans lead their normal lives with extra hand washing and special care if around elderly. Saving the economy means life, not murder.#COVID19"
Have you seen what that Dr. Burry guy from the big short had to say about this shutdown?
Just to let you know... not everyone agrees with you...
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...s-virus-lockdowns-in-controversial-tweetstorm
"Prudent plan: 1) Standardize on chloroquine and azithromycin -cheap and available 2) Sick and elderly voluntarily shelter in place. 3) Americans lead their normal lives with extra hand washing and special care if around elderly. Saving the economy means life, not murder.#COVID19"
The first step "Standardize on chloroquine and azithromycin" is a problem. Nealy all the incoming evidence appears to indicate that chloroquine and azithromycin therapy does not yield positive results. Of course, we need to wait several weeks for multiple trials to complete in order to have proper medical study results. Countries including India and South Korea have stopped treating COVID-19 with chloroquine.
Interesting to note that the crime rates around the world have plummeted.... where Burry gets the concept of equating "stay at home" to murder --- has no support in the statistics and figures.
Crime Rates Plummet Around the World as the Coronavirus Keeps People Inside
https://time.com/5819507/crime-drop-coronavirus/
Crime rates drop across the nation amid coronavirus
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/491055-crime-rates-drop-across-the-nation-amid-coronavirus
Last edited:
Long Island doctor tries new twist on hydroxychloroquine for elderly COVID-19 patients
https://nypost.com/2020/04/04/long-island-doctor-tries-new-hydroxychloroquine-for-covid-19-patients/
Dr. Mohammud Alam, an infectious disease specialist affiliated with Plainview Hospital, said 81 percent of infected covid patients he treated at three Long Island nursing homes recovered from the contagion.
“In this crisis, I realized I had to do something,” Alam said. ”I realized if this was my dad, what would I do? And I would do anything I could to help.”
So instead, Alam replaced azithromycin with another decades-old antibiotic that doesn’t pose any known risks to the heart.
“Doxycycline is an anti-inflammatory with properties similar to azithromycin but without the safety concerns and without cardiac toxicity,” he said.
Alam said he decided he could not apply the touted combination of the antimalarial hydroxychloroquine and antibiotic azithromycin because the side effects could be potentially fatal for his high-risk patients,
https://nypost.com/2020/04/04/long-island-doctor-tries-new-hydroxychloroquine-for-covid-19-patients/
Dr. Mohammud Alam, an infectious disease specialist affiliated with Plainview Hospital, said 81 percent of infected covid patients he treated at three Long Island nursing homes recovered from the contagion.
“In this crisis, I realized I had to do something,” Alam said. ”I realized if this was my dad, what would I do? And I would do anything I could to help.”
So instead, Alam replaced azithromycin with another decades-old antibiotic that doesn’t pose any known risks to the heart.
“Doxycycline is an anti-inflammatory with properties similar to azithromycin but without the safety concerns and without cardiac toxicity,” he said.
Alam said he decided he could not apply the touted combination of the antimalarial hydroxychloroquine and antibiotic azithromycin because the side effects could be potentially fatal for his high-risk patients,
have you graduated a US licensed med school?
are you privy to studies we have not seen on the internet.
You are speaking with a ton of authority and your summary of the situation is not consistent with what I have read on the net... or a circular a doctor friend of mine quoted.
When i did a search... I saw lots of ancedotal evidence showing doctors seeing favorable results for hydoxy combined with and something else, for all but the most critical patients.
Now, I too would provide the caveat we have to wait and see.
But, I am not writing with authority the way you are.
are you privy to studies we have not seen on the internet.
You are speaking with a ton of authority and your summary of the situation is not consistent with what I have read on the net... or a circular a doctor friend of mine quoted.
When i did a search... I saw lots of ancedotal evidence showing doctors seeing favorable results for hydoxy combined with and something else, for all but the most critical patients.
Now, I too would provide the caveat we have to wait and see.
But, I am not writing with authority the way you are.
Last edited:
Yes... and I have already posted multiple links showing the evidence that chloroquine based therapy is not working -- with the caution that we need for completion of proper medical studies several weeks from now to draw any proper conclusions. There are only two published studies involving chloroquine that have been published showing positive results; the Raoult study in France for removed as being sub-standard and the Wuhan study that involved no control group. Hearsay on the net is not proper medical evidence. I have already outlined the recommendations in South Korea and India that doctors not use chloroquine on COVID-19 patients.