Let's get real about prison abuse

A

AAAintheBeltway

This prison abuse "scandal" is getting out of hand. I suppose part of the problem is that most of the media, congress and public have never been in the military, much less a war zone and certainly not a military prison. I don't condone a few reservists taking trophy pictures of their days as prison guards in Iraq, but there is a serious lack of proportion here.

What exactly are people so upset about? That the prisoners are naked? That they are hooded in some cases? I hate to be the one to inform you naive people, but that is pretty much standard interrogation technique. That some of them maybe were wired? Would it "shock" you to learn that Special Forces troops have that done to them in training to prepare them for it?

Is it the sexual overtones? I think that was staged for humiliation purposes, again, a standard interrogation practice.

Let's face it. Without these pictures of grinning guards posing with prisoners, no one would give a hoot about any of this. In fact, I guarantee you worse goes on at Gitmo, just no pictures allowed.

How many of these congressmen who are shocked, shocked mind you, and outraged beyond belief, how many of them have done a thing to stop the epidemic of prisoner rape in our own prison system? How many of them have said a word about the abuse Americans experience in Mexican jails and prisons? How many of them are screaming about the abuse that Castro and the Chinese mete out to political prisoners? Certainly not Dem. Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi.

These prisoners were not being interrogated for amusement. They were picked up as insurgents and had valuable information that could save our soldiers' lives. Did mistakes happen? Of course, it is war. That is why it is not a good thing to have your country invaded and taken over by an enemy.

I am very disappointed that no one has the guts to stand up and say that this is unseemly, but hardly the human rights outrage it is being painted as.
 
....well.....It kind of looked like a frat house hazing picture....BUT!!!!.....what if Sgt. Joe Smith of N. Carolina was naked with an Iraqi mugging for the camera and having fun?.....WHAT IF IT WAS JESSICA LYNCH??? could you imagine if they stripped her or another female soldier and mugged for the camera???????
 
Quote from TM_Direct:

....well.....It kind of looked like a frat house hazing picture....BUT!!!!.....what if Sgt. Joe Smith of N. Carolina was naked with an Iraqi mugging for the camera and having fun?.....WHAT IF IT WAS JESSICA LYNCH??? could you imagine if they stripped her or another female soldier and mugged for the camera???????
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Actually I'm pretty sure an american female POW was raped by the Iraqi's during the first gulf war. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Lynch also assaulted?
 
The importance of the images is that it starkly illustrates a behavior and methodology wholly inconsistent with the the best American ideals, which we are trying to promote among non-militant Islamics. The images summon the collective Iraqi memory of the terror practiced in Saddam's day, make us look like hypocrites, and appears to put us on the level of Saddam's people.

The difference that must be put forth is this is rogue behavior and not an instance of institutionalized behavior (I hope). The US has to own up to it, condemn it, punish the wrongdoers, and not let it vitiate the US military and civilian operations that are ongoing in Iraq. And, they must operate POW prisons effectively and reasonably.
 
Quote from TL Trader:

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Lynch also assaulted?
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hmm.... possible, could have been sometime between when she slaughtered that battalion of baath sympathizers with a rambo knife while signing "battle hymn of the republic," and when she sewed an american flag out of hospital gowns and gauze waiting for the elite delta-force rescue....
 
Quote from dgabriel:

The importance of the images is that it starkly illustrates a behavior and methodology wholly inconsistent with the the best American ideals, which we are trying to promote among non-militant Islamics. The images summon the collective Iraqi memory of the terror practiced in Saddam's day, make us look like hypocrites, and appears to put us on the level of Saddam's people.

The difference that must be put forth is this is rogue behavior and not an instance of institutionalized behavior (I hope). The US has to own up to it, condemn it, punish the wrongdoers, and not let it vitiate the US military and civilian operations that are ongoing in Iraq. And, they must operate POW prisons effectively and reasonably.
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I think you have succinctly summarized the general reaction. But my question is, what is the behavior you are referring to? Is it applying coercion to prisoners or is it taking goofy pictures that do indeed resemble hazing? See, my point is the pictures are rogue behavior, but applying coercion to prisoners is standard procedure. The American media, congress and public just don't want to have to think about it.
 
Quote from TL Trader:

Actually I'm pretty sure an american female POW was raped by the Iraqi's during the first gulf war. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Lynch also assaulted?
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Yes, I believe she was a physician who went down in a chopper crash. It was hushed up, no doubt in part because she didn't want the notoriety and in part for fears that the American public would demand public hangings.
 
Quote from AAAintheBeltway:

I think you have succinctly summarized the general reaction. But my question is, what is the behavior you are referring to? Is it applying coercion to prisoners or is it taking goofy pictures that do indeed resemble hazing? See, my point is the pictures are rogue behavior, but applying coercion to prisoners is standard procedure. The American media, congress and public just don't want to have to think about it.
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somehow doubt the average Iraqi looks at those pictures and says "what egregious violations of standard interrogation protocol!"....

the pictures fit directly with a view of America as bullying, pretentious, disrespectful, amoral, invading a muslim country under pretense of assistance then revealing its true nature by humiliating and subjugating the powerless while laughing and joking about it.

the fact that only a handful of fools out of tens of thousands of honorable soldiers actually perpetrated it is secondary to the media images - just as the fact that only a few saudis acted on 9/11 or a few somalians dragged a dead marine through the streets was secondary in the labelling of entire countries.
 
They should take those Iraqi scum and throw them into Riker's Island. Mofos will be begging for the gay pyramid in a week, that is if they even survive that long.
 
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