I have always believed then, that the Chinese were developing some form of biological weapon in Wuhan. Whether it was accidentally, released or deliberate, I would tend to be believe it is deliberate. Imagine if you had vials of viruses and numerous spies abroad to spread it? The US and Europe is how far from China? The Philippines got its very first Corona Virus case from a Chinese national on a tourist visa. Yet, the Corona Virus spread like wildfire everywhere. No country was spared and even with advances in modern medicine, doctors everywhere could not stop it? Don't you find it convenient that the Chinese own most of manufacturers of masks and medical equipment which stood to benefit from a worldwide pandemic? They managed to contain the virus in Wuhan, China only for the most part. They also, miraculously, had a vaccine in short order? How convenient is that? That the Chinese were doling out masks and protective equipment and vaccines to poor countries? Okay, you can say they are being charitable however, that is a good PR ploy on their part on their vaccines and medical protective equipment? That of course, serves their economic and military interests.
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- Thread starter gwb-trading
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I have always believed then, that the Chinese were developing some form of biological weapon in Wuhan. Whether it was accidentally, released or deliberate, I would tend to be believe it is deliberate. Imagine if you had vials of viruses and numerous spies abroad to spread it? The US and Europe is how far from China? The Philippines got its very first Corona Virus case from a Chinese national on a tourist visa. Yet, the Corona Virus spread like wildfire everywhere. No country was spared and even with advances in modern medicine, doctors everywhere could not stop it? Don't you find it convenient that the Chinese own most of manufacturers of masks and medical equipment which stood to benefit from a worldwide pandemic? They managed to contain the virus in Wuhan, China only for the most part. They also, miraculously, had a vaccine in short order? How convenient is that? That the Chinese were doling out masks and protective equipment and vaccines to poor countries? Okay, you can say they are being charitable however, that is a good PR ploy on their part on their vaccines and medical protective equipment? That of course, serves their economic and military interests.
The approval should be in place by now or a denial of it.
This is the kind of extra months in the process that should be removed in an emergency. The Americans have had the same opportunity to review what the Europeans and Canadians looked at. The nature of an "emergency authorization" is that it is an "emergency" and steps get accelerated so that the perfect does not become the enemy of the good.
The Biden bootlickers are merely trying to create a basis for justifying his giving away of vaccines meant for Americans. We have villages in Alaska that have no vaccine. We have Puerto Ricans who are getting no vaccine. We have entire prisons that have outbreaks but no vaccine. The dead people who will be coming from there could be a reason for expediting or allowing the distribution of that vaccine.
Absurd.
Biden using Trump vaccines- once again- for political bargaining. Every effort should have been and should be made to make those doses available to Americans. Biden and his swamp are footdragging on the approval to artificially make the doses available to meet Biden backroom dealings with Mexico and Canada.
Fuck Biden and the horse he road in on. That is an abuse of the process and the good work of the people who came before him. Those doses are for Americans.
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An Emergency Use Authorization will not be granted for any vaccine until the Phase 3 trial is completed. The Phase 3 trial for AstraZeneca in the U.S. started later than the other vaccines and is only wrapping up recently. It is unreasonable to expect emergency use approval before the beginning of April (even on the original schedule). If the FDA granted emergency use authorization before the Phase 3 trials for safety and efficacy were completed & documented then no one would trust the vaccine.
Yeh, I am not going to replay the history of this.
I will say again that phase 3 was completed months ago in europe and britain and other countries and they got a major jumpstart by collaborating between countries and with the actual pharmaceutical company so that they were all reviewing data together. Emperor Fauci and the other swampsters said they would not do that because they wanted to go the normal route which is you do your thing, the next person does their thing and we will drag this all out. Even though they just end out getting to see the same fucking data that the others have already seen.
You can give it out on an expedited basis for those who consent to it and also be going the longer route. If you accept the idea that it is an emergency and if you do that implies that some corners get cut. Cutting some corners has also led to vaccines arriving years earlier too.
The left treats the WHO as though it is a god and has all the "scientists and experts." They have approved using it. Ditto for Britain, the EU, and Canada and shiiteload of other civilized countries. Biden and the lefties like to pound their chest and say this is war and this is a dire emergency and we are going to exercise emergency powers, then they cry that we cannot expedite the review or emergency use of a vaccine that has been extensively reviewed by other world health authorities because Biden promised those doses to Mexico and Canada because Biden needs to smooth Trudeau over on canceling the pipeline, and Biden needs to buy some help from Mexico for his borders problems.
Fucking bullshiite on steroids.
I am not going to name names but I am flat out ashamed of several people on forum for buying into that bullshit. I am done with the topic for the day. My bullshiite meter is maxed out. People should be ashamed of themselves.
The United States has pledged 4 billion dollars to the WHO COVAX PROGRAM to fund vaccines for other countries. Mexico and Canada need to go there and get their vaccines which will be Chinese because that is how the game is played. We pay for it, then everyone says we are vaccine nationalists who do nothing to help other countries. Bullshit. I accept that that is how they roll, but dont steal goddam vaccines from Americans on top of it. That is a bridge too far and Joe Biden is fucking political hack moron playing santa claus with vaccines that could be made available to Americans on an expedited basis.
I don't see why the U.S. should trust processes for vaccine and drug review performed in other countries. We can ask that the information from other countries to be submitted as supplemental data but it should never replace doing Phase 3 trials in the U.S. with our protocols, controls, and own people which represent the American population.
If you open up allowing the U.S. to use Phase 3 trials performed in other countries for approval -- where does it stop. If you open the door to Britain and Europe then you surely will need to trust data submitted by China, Russia, and India to be used for approval -- otherwise the lawsuits will start on why they are excluded from the "fast lane".
brb, let's get the Sinovax and sputnik and trust China and Russia w/o doing our own vetting.
Try to understand that if we are in an emergency you may expedite some things and not every process will be perfect. I did not really read your post above but out of the corner of my eye I see the bottom bullshit statement so that is all I need to see.
If we rely on data from trusted sources and allies to take emergency actions that does not require us to look at any other fucking data that we do not wish to consider. Similarly if we are at war and want to take data from our allies on trusted/emergency basis it does not create a requirement that we look at Chinese, Russian or any other data or studies that we do not wish to rely upon. Use your head for christ sake. You are one who cries everyday that we are all going to die if we do not vaccines outs there, then you cry because beltway processes get expedited.
I am stopping here. You have fallen into the dem trance state where you see what Biden wants to do and then back your reasoning into it. The benefits of distributing that vaccine now clearly outweigh the risks, as determined by all the organizations I mentioned. You can keep pointing out that the FDA has not done its thing, and that is the problem. If they took this situation seriously they would have engaged early on with the others and cut a couple months out of the process. If problems crop up after it is approved as happened in Europe then they can respond to them, just as problems have and will crop up for the vaccines already approved.
Figure out whether we are at war or working down at the DMV.
This thread is getting wild. On one hand @TreeFrogTrader wants us to allow the AZ shot based on the euros and the WHO and on the other he derides the Euros and WHO.
Look. I don’t like the latest EU statement on AZ saying they cannot guarantee the shot isn’t causing blood clots. I get that it probably doesn’t but the AZ vaccine has been plagued with various problems for a long time and we should give it extra scrutiny because of that. I also highly doubt that introducing the AZ shot into the US will help anything considering we are nearing maximum capability of shots we can actually administer. We did 4 million shots last Saturday for example and that was after hitting 3 million shots the week before.
Look. I don’t like the latest EU statement on AZ saying they cannot guarantee the shot isn’t causing blood clots. I get that it probably doesn’t but the AZ vaccine has been plagued with various problems for a long time and we should give it extra scrutiny because of that. I also highly doubt that introducing the AZ shot into the US will help anything considering we are nearing maximum capability of shots we can actually administer. We did 4 million shots last Saturday for example and that was after hitting 3 million shots the week before.
You hit on another important point. With three approved vaccines we basically have arrived at the maximum number of doses we can administer per day in the U.S. We have hospitals, clinics, doctor offices, U.S. military, drug stores and other facilities all providing doses. We are shortly adding dentists and veterinarians to mix of people giving doses. At some point we will shortly hit 5 million doses per day -- but this will be near our maximum potential for jabs in arms per day without hiring many more people. Shortly -- in about a month -- the vaccine supply in the U.S. will not be a constraint... so the limitation will be based on our daily ability to get shots into arms.
I said the Americans should be engaging with Europeans early on so that they could collaborate and look at the data as Astrazenica and the other countries were looking at it. That is how the Brits and others shaved months off their process. And the Americans would be part of shaping that process versus your jaundiced interpretation of my words to try to say that we should just rely upon them.
Shame on you. And shame on a couple others here.
Now you are edging toward the dem script that says we have enough vaccine now to be giving it away to other countries because that is what Biden needs. And you say we cant distribute and vaccinate more so that makes sense. What a crock that is. That is just a backhanded way of saying you are doing a piss-poor job of ramping up the distribution system to meet the supply so why dont we tamp the supply piece down a bit.
Meanwhile Florida has just been informed that Johnson and Johnson has no more vaccine for that state and will not have it for weeks at best. Joe wants his distribution numbers to go up so that he can crow about it but it is consuming all the available vaccine in some areas for weeks to come. Yet Biden is giving it away and you are cool with it, because, hey, we cannot distribute and vaccinate anyway.
Shame.