Iterative Refinement

Quote from sscott:

Thanks Spyder,
The reason I'm out here without a TV is exactly so I'm not listening to outside info. I did get the point, and know that P/V is the only thing I need. BTW my airline is to friggin cheap to buy me a heads up display.......
sscott
:D :D

I think I should re-phrase my question... DID anything happen at 10:50 that triggered the run-up, or did this happen without any outside influence?
 
11:52 though is the market moving as it always does in which case I am with you 100% on the YM and ES relationship at points of change. No disagreement there.

But with news releases, I'm just not convinced yet.

Fortunately, news releases are not the norm so if I choose to avoid them, I wont miss too much action :)

To each his own...


Quote from Spydertrader:

I'm not talking about stop losses here. I'm showing you how the YM leads the ES at points of change (often several minutes in advance. When the YM doesn't provide the early warning signal, the STR / SQU does. In this case we 'see' the signal a full two minutes before the announcement. Again, at 11:52 (all times Eastern and at close of bar) the YM showed increasing Volume with significantly less Volatility. What happened next? These dominos fall, in the same fashion, all day, every day in every market on the planet.

- Spydertrader
 
Quote from sscott:

I think I should re-phrase my question... DID anything happen at 10:50 that triggered the run-up, or did this happen without any outside influence?

Market Sentiment Changed.

- Spydertrader
 
Quote from The Swordsman:

But with news releases, I'm just not convinced yet.

To each his own...

Swordsman,

With all due respect. I believe, as do others that are farther down the path than I, is that when Spyder makes a statement, the very best course of action is two fold.

First (and most critically) is to jettison my own set of beliefs on a particular matter and accept Spyders statements as fact .

Second, go about figuring out how he observes the market.

This particular disposition has yet to fail me and has greatly improved my own experience :D
 
Quote from Spydertrader:

Assuming today's trading ended at 11:00 AM this morning (Eastern Time), the market provided three crystal clear signals - enter, reverse and exit. Today's quiz: Post the signals, when they occurred, why they occurred, and whether or not you followed them.

- Spydertrader

The following assumes FTT=>FTT/FBO/BO framework.

I have been working on this post since yesterday and most of the observations are obvious for all who has been at it for a while, but hopefully this will be useful to those who are just starting, as I am.

I made this analysis, which is totally incorrect:
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=1895329#post1895329

My second attempt was also incorrect:
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=1895395#post1895395

Spydertrader noted my mistaken approach to drawing channels:

Quote from Spydertrader:

How do you have a channel where you have marked your first grey down channel of the day?
and
Quote from Spydertrader:

… why do you have a channel (Points One two and Three labelled across a minimum of three bars) annotated? You may have subsequently described this area as a 'tape' but it is not labelled (nor annotated) as such. A tape uses two bars for three of the points - differenciated from the 'chubby tape' by Points One and Two on bar One while Point Three falls two bars later.

Specifically the first tape of the day is not a channel. It’s a “chubby” tape where pt1 and pt2 located on the same bar and subsequent pt3 comes one or two bar later.

And it wasn’t even annotated correctly:

Quote from Spydertrader:

I specifically pointed you to the grey down channel at the beginning of the day. You have a Point Two labeled where Price touches no trend line.

Then I drew some more incorrect pictures

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=1895431#post1895431

And Avi 8 was patient enough with my sloppy missing the true color of bar 6:

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=1895447#post1895447


After looking at yesterday’s morning chart for a very long time I failed to see any possible way to draw a pt3 channel using any or all of the first 7 bars of the day.

A chubby tape with pt1 and pt2 residing on bar 2 and pt3 on bar 4 is possible to draw and is shown in the attachment ( hopefully annotated correctly this time. Thanks to LostTrader and his indicators I am beginning find my way through colors). That tape has an FTT on it, but


Quote from Spydertrader:

Does tape = channel?

And that’s what really important.

In other words, what happened as I should have seen it (if my annotating wasn’t so sloppy) is:

Bar1: VE of the previous day CO channel
Bar2: FTT of the previous day CO channel and pt3 of the new down channel (channel overlap)
Bar3: traverse continues towards the pt2 of the new channel (not to be confused with the chubby tape)
Bar4: pt3 and FTT of the chubby tape, possible suspect for pt2 of the new channel
Bar5: chubby tape BO on decreased volume

No increasing red volume arrived until bar 8 (outside bar and IBGS).

Quote from Spydertrader:

The outside Bar was once increasing red before it became an outside bar and ended increasing black.

The sequence that started with FTT on bar 2 which became pt1 of the new channel, had to be followed by pt2 , pt3 and VE/FTT or FTT before the price could move any higher.

Therefore if one had entered short on bar 2 (FTT) one could not have reversed long until an FTT in the opposite direction, which can only come after pt3. (that assumes FTT=>FTT/FBO/BO rules apply)

Thank you Spydertrader and Avi 8 for your patience and support. I feel like somebody whacked me on the side of my head, cause I browsed through couple of weeks of old charts and this thing just keeps cycling: 1,2,3, FTT. I read it multiple times and sort of understood, but I think I finally got it.

Now I have to work on my Gaussians and those nasty outside IBGS bars when they are one of the critical points:1,2,3 or FTT.
 

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I had a bulb or two go off today, thanks to Spyders advice "higher high, lower low" a few days back. The gaussians were clear.
At least I think so, and I'll savour the moment because it'll probably only last till I compare my chart with guavamans, losttraders et al. :)
 

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This morning was very nice, even smooth.
My entries look "late" - I only act when it feels "safe", and in both cases, it was when I saw the 2nd 123 channel on the YM, that the ES entry looked good.

Montioring was only through the morning & lunch (active lunch!). The afternoon was hindsight, simply filling in the forest notations.
 

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