Intelligent design not so intellignt.

Quote from peilthetraveler:

You cant just say that and then not give us some examples. Please list some of these "wonderful" things.
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Well then I suppose I can't just say that theism has been responsible for some wonderful and altruistic things without listing examples?

But since your bias seemingly prevents you from contemplating any good attributable to atheism, I suppose I'll help you out.

Many of the technologies you may enjoy or need are a result of freed minds in the sciences. Many Nobel laureates are/were atheist. Many activists around the world who labor for human rights and peace are atheist. Atheist musicians, composers and artists have made lasting contributions to their respective fields. Atheist authors, lawyers, doctors, etc have made important and...

Well you know what, have a look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nontheists.
 
Quote from Free Thinker:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbef07aQtB8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T27kB4BjbEg&feature=related
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Interesting...Didnt know Natalie Portman was atheist. Especially when she once said that when she has kids, she wants them to grow up in the jewish religion. Kinda weird that an atheist would want that for thier kids unless of course they thought atheism was likely to cause people to be very immoral.

Of course saying that america would be like all those muslim countries, or then using S.E. asian countries that just 20 years ago were run by brutal dictators and then saying "SEE...religion is bad because the country is doing bad...." Well thats just propaganda.

I could pick that video apart even more about the facts being off, but I think you get my point.
 
Quote from PatternRec:

Well then I suppose I can't just say that theism has been responsible for some wonderful and altruistic things without listing examples?

But since your bias seemingly prevents you from contemplating any good attributable to atheism, I suppose I'll help you out.

Many of the technologies you may enjoy or need are a result of freed minds in the sciences. Many Nobel laureates are/were atheist. Many activists around the world who labor for human rights and peace are atheist. Atheist musicians, composers and artists have made lasting contributions to their respective fields. Atheist authors, lawyers, doctors, etc have made important and...

Well you know what, have a look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nontheists.
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All those technologies...though the athests stood on the backs of the Christian thinkers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_thinkers_in_science

Oh...your link was broken, but lucky for you I was able to find it. Wow...what a list. And such impressive people on it, like Sheldon Brown, the bicycle mechanic and technical authority on almost every aspect of bicycles. Or Elizer Wright, the father of life insurance (thanks for that one atheists!)
 
Observing and documenting material behavior (knowledge) as it occurs in the physical or material world is one objective, whereas producing theories or evidence of origin another. Origin, whether natural selection or watchmaker, requires faith (belief). As such, it seems logical (to me) to objectively present both theories in an environment where "free thinking" is encouraged.
 
Quote from peilthetraveler:

All those technologies...though the athests stood on the backs of the Christian thinkers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_thinkers_in_science
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They sure did to some degree. The work of some notable Christian and Islamic thinkers is foundational to modern science. At the same time though, many "Christian thinkers" were persecuted for their research that contradicted or disproved current religious thought at the time. To the Catholic Church's credit, they been far more open to science than at any time in their history. They still have quite a ways to go.

In any event, what happened? Why have Christians and Muslims in this age seemingly all but dropped scientific inquiry?


Oh...your link was broken, but lucky for you I was able to find it. Wow...what a list. And such impressive people on it, like Sheldon Brown, the bicycle mechanic and technical authority on almost every aspect of bicycles. Or Elizer Wright, the father of life insurance (thanks for that one atheists!)
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I didn't realize the Sheldon Brown was an atheist. I use his informative websites often andI'm an avid cyclist.

Also, on Natalie Portman, Judaism is more than just a religion. It's a culture and community. She would probably raise her children in the liberal Jewish community. While they embrace the Jewish tradition, its hallmark is that it embraces rational thought and scientific evidence.
 
Quote from ehorn:

Observing and documenting material behavior (knowledge) as it occurs in the physical or material world is one objective, whereas producing theories or evidence of origin another. Origin, whether natural selection or watchmaker, requires faith (belief). As such, it seems logical (to me) to objectively present both theories in an environment where "free thinking" is encouraged.
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Yes...it does seem logical except the person presenting the theories is going to lean to whatever side he believes and push that theory.

The world has definately been set up that we have a choice in what to believe. You can find just enough wiggle room in everyones beliefs that you can be convinced or unconvinced of whatever it is you believe or dont believe.
 
Quote from PatternRec:


In any event, what happened? Why have Christians and Muslims in this age seemingly all but dropped scientific inquiry?
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Still plenty of them around. For some reason though the mainstream media doesnt seem to like to put their accomplishments out there. If its not an atheist finding another monkey claiming it to be a long lost human ancestor, then it doesnt make the news.

Here are the Christian scientists.

http://english.sdaglobal.org/research/sctstbel.htm#_Toc71912180
 
Quote from peilthetraveler:

Struggle is one thing that can make humans grow spiritually. When you see a suffering newborn baby, dont you want to help them? Many people do want to help and some will go on to help. Maybe a person will see a suffering newborn baby and then dedicate their life to helping others. Those others he helped, some will remember the kindness they were shown and go on to help others too. Maybe 1000s of people (like drug users, theives, prostitutes, or other people like that) who were suffering because of their own sins that put them in their situations, will now be put on the right path and go on to help others of their own kind or of a different kind. Why did all those people get help? Because of one suffering newborn that probably died shortly after being born and is in heaven now.

Maybe the empathy felt by 1 person for that suffering newborn, would eventually bring 1000s of others to Christ and save them from hell.

Maybe if we as humans didnt break so many commandments on a daily basis, there would be no need for these babies to suffer in the first place. But men love their sins, dont they?

I bet if you had kids you would give them a vaccine shot even though it temporarily causes suffering for a few minutes for the baby, right? You give them the vaccine because you believe it will save them from greater suffering later. How is it any different with God? He creates a little suffering now, to save many from greater suffering later.

You wanted to know if we could think of ANY reason. Well there is one.
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interesting.but i do follow your reasoning,such as it is. your god makes little babies suffer now so he wont have to make them suffer in hell later.
let me ask you a question. when you had babies did you consider murdering them so they get a free pass to heaven and to eliminate the possibility of them rejecting god and going to hell later?
 
Quote from peilthetraveler:

Yes...it does seem logical except the person presenting the theories is going to lean to whatever side he believes and push that theory.

The world has definately been set up that we have a choice in what to believe. You can find just enough wiggle room in everyones beliefs that you can be convinced or unconvinced of whatever it is you believe or dont believe.
More...
you really dont have a clue how science works. serious question. were you educated in a church school?
 
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