I Find Myself Feeling More Racist Over The Years....

[smallStops]

In other threads you have stated you are black. You are a liar.

I too believed his lies, and, based on his false information, gave him some videos to watch
as I was eagger to see the effects on black americans who try it, so that I could have asked him questions
directly about how these effects are created.

I wonder if Money_Trust believed that posing for a black man would give him more credibility
if/when he "approaves" of statements that could be constructed as bigotted, sexist or prejudiced, or at least questionnable. Now I understand why he used the ignore button when challenged by a Lady for his sexist comments.

 

[Scataphagos]

Thank you for being open about how you see things.
Be reassured : you were not born a racist, but you got sensitized, tried not to become one, and now
are one , and are embrassing your new "status" without complexes.
The last bit is the one thing I admire in you: your self-honesty about what you are.


Can you explain, from an American perspective, what is liberalism and in what ways you believe liberalism
turns people into racists.

Since I made that post, I've thought about it and would change the description of how I feel. Wary though I am now of blacks in general and especially groups of young males, I still don't (what's the word, "denigrate"?) blacks just because they're black. I believe that's what racism is, and I'm not about that. (One of my wife's partners is black. This summer he had a birthday party for his wife and invited us. There were 40-50 blacks and about 6 of us whiteys. I probably got a couple of "looks", but felt positive about the entire event and had a good time. Fortunately, I live in an area where blacks are not a mob or cultural problem like in Ferguson. (I used to live close to Ferguson, too.)

Liberalism.... it's one of the "Leftist" ideologies, and a bit nebulous to pin down as to definition. First let me say "Leftism" = Liberalism, Socialism, Progressive-ism, Communism, Marxism, Nazism... in some variety. The American DemoCrap party has adopted Leftism in the form of Liberal/Progressive/Socialist.

One way to define the difference between Liberal (left) and Conservative (right)... at least as has been adopted in the USA... is Liberals are "liberal with spending other peoples money... especially to buy political favor from (certain) voters". Conservatives are more "conservative" about spending other peoples money. The line of demarcation between the two major parties is often blurred and shifting.

In America, the Liberals' "cornerstone of policy" (regardless of how they obfuscate or lie about it) is wealth redistribution. But America was never about that until about 1900. The "Evils of Wealth Redistribution in America" would make a good subject for a PhD dissertation. Giving certain people LOTS for free... especially when it's ongoing and becomes a life style.... causes LOTS of serious problems. And it's even worse when the "for free" comes at the expense of other citizens.

 

[smallStops]

Scataphagos,

In my country, we redistribute a LOT of the money.
Just to give you some example that would shock you:
- we have a policy of giving monthly grants to students for them to continue into University.
- hospitals are obviously free . We were shocked about your debate on health insurance.
- school is free - including graduate education. The only time a president wanted to charge
university, I remember massive strikes ( from kindergarten age to retired home people down
in the street making clear they did not want that).

Nowadays, some have deep issues with politicians who want to destroy what we call
our social protection safety net ( free university education is considered as part of the country safety net).

So that you know, Scandinavians countries are often a model for us.
This can mean : luxurious prisons like:

This is why I asked about what is Liberalism for the USA.
Now, you can understand why I have difficulties understanding your politics.

 

[smallStops]

Actually, when the party I am joining is in good position, one policy I'll put forward is to build all prisons
into 7 star hotels. No criminal record myself, and I do not intend to have any.

 

[Scataphagos]

Scataphagos,

In my country, we redistribute a LOT of the money.
Just to give you some example that would shock you:
- we have a policy of giving monthly grants to students for them to continue into University.
- hospitals are obviously free . We were shocked about your debate on health insurance.
- school is free - including graduate education. The only time a president wanted to charge
university, I remember massive strikes ( from kindergarten age to retired home people down
in the street making clear they did not want that).

Nowadays, some have deep issues with politicians who want to destroy what we call
our social protection safety net ( free university education is considered as part of the country safety net).

So that you know, Scandinavians countries are often a model for us.
This can mean : luxurious prisons like:

This is why I asked about what is Liberalism for the USA.
Now, you can understand why I have difficulties understanding your politics.

Scataphagos,

In my country, we redistribute a LOT of the money.
Just to give you some example that would shock you:
- we have a policy of giving monthly grants to students for them to continue into University.
- hospitals are obviously free . We were shocked about your debate on health insurance.
- school is free - including graduate education. The only time a president wanted to charge
university, I remember massive strikes ( from kindergarten age to retired home people down
in the street making clear they did not want that).

Nowadays, some have deep issues with politicians who want to destroy what we call
our social protection safety net ( free university education is considered as part of the country safety net).

So that you know, Scandinavians countries are often a model for us.
This can mean : luxurious prisons like:

This is why I asked about what is Liberalism for the USA.
Now, you can understand why I have difficulties understanding your politics.

That is too big of a question... "Why does Socialism/Marxism appear to be viable for the societies of Scandinavian countries and not in the US?" I'm not qualified to offer an opinion.

As for my personal politics... I'm an advocate of the US Constitution. America was founded upon the notion of "personal liberties and freedoms"... from government oppression and government intervention in our lives.

My Grandfather used to tell me, "The world doesn't owe you a living. Make something of yourself". And, "If you plan on eating regular, you'd better plan on working". That's America (well, it was). We grew up with no Socialist structure like you have. We see things differently. In your country, "everybody gets certain stuff for free/government expense" (like education, health care, stipend) In America, CERTAIN people get stuff for free, other people pay for the recipients "freebies" but get NOTHING for free themselves. Maybe that's it. ?? (And the resentment is growing.)

I see Scandinavian socialist societies to be a form of the hippie communes here in the 1970s. The communes are gone... didn't work for us. I'll have to defer to others for a logical and researched explanation.

 

[smallStops]

Your comments are getting me to think.
I am now starting to wonder IF we see things from the point of view of Society in general.
Let me explain on the free education example.

If a student is given a stipend to go to University, then many students will go to University who would not.
So instead , may be of having unemployed youth, we have them studying. Sure, this might displace the problem for after University, however, an educated person is less likely to get involved in violent crimes.
I would not be astonished if the rate of criminal crimes from black US college-educated person is extremely low compared to non college educated.
So may be for our "thinkers", paying a stipend costs less actually for society than having non college-educated individuals.

Now, I realise that when I looked to the Scandinavian prisons, what strike my attention was the extremely low recidivism rate. As a society, a low recidivism rate is beneficial. For a whole country, a 7 star prison might cost 7 million$, but for a country budget this is a tiny drop that can have much more benefits for the whole country.

May be our social system works ( we are trying to protect it from the assaults of some
misguided politicians), because we think of the cost for the whole country, and for all the citizen first, not just interest groups or only some regions.
But sure, this is a very good "salon discussion"

 

[Scataphagos]

Your comments are getting me to think.
I am now starting to wonder IF we see things from the point of view of Society in general.
Let me explain on the free education example.

If a student is given a stipend to go to University, then many students will go to University who would not.
So instead , may be of having unemployed youth, we have them studying. Sure, this might displace the problem for after University, however, an educated person is less likely to get involved in violent crimes.
I would not be astonished if the rate of criminal crimes from black US college-educated person is extremely low compared to non college educated.
So may be for our "thinkers", paying a stipend costs less actually for society than having non college-educated individuals.

Now, I realise that when I looked to the Scandinavian prisons, what strike my attention was the extremely low recidivism rate. As a society, a low recidivism rate is beneficial. For a whole country, a 7 star prison might cost 7 million$, but for a country budget this is a tiny drop that can have much more benefits for the whole country.

May be our social system works ( we are trying to protect it from the assaults of some
misguided politicians), because we think of the cost for the whole country, and for all the citizen first, not just interest groups or only some regions.
But sure, this is a very good "salon discussion"

It's interesting, your view and mine.

(Apparently) you've always taken for granted... that certain important "things" were free to all citizens, provided by government.

My view is this... I'VE BEEN FUCKED-OVER EVERY DAY OF MY ADULT LIFE BY MY GOVERNMENT. I served in the military when I didn't want to. I was denied college aid BECAUSE I was a military veteran. I've paid $MILLIONS in income taxes over the years... AND NEVER RECEIVED A FUCKING THING FROM THE GOVERNMENT... other than what we all receive... federal highway system, federal judicial system, national defense, things like that. If some were to view my life as a "success", it wouldn't be because of what government gave me... rather it would be IN SPITE OF BEING FUCKED-OVER DAILY BY MY GOVERNMENT!

Yet there are other citizens... quite a lot of them.... who don't work, don't contribute to society (many even commit crimes as a way of life)... they just TAKE, AND TAKE, AND TAKE, AND TAKE... all at MY expense. How am I supposed to appreciate that?

 

[stock777]

Can't happen to me, Im already at Max Racist

 

[stock777]

I used to. But that was when I was stupid which was up to about a week ago. Now I realize that only racist people think this way about Jesse and Al. Jesse and Al are looking out for their "tribe" which is being slaughtered by the cops in every city in America. Kind of like the way they used to lynch them without a trial. Same thing. The minorities are mad in this country. They have had enough. Actually for a long time they have had enough. They will keep fighting. They are getting more pissed off. Just watch.

Blow me

 

[smallStops]

It's interesting, your view and mine.

(Apparently) you've always taken for granted... that certain importing "things" were free and provided by government.

My view is this... I'VE BEEN FUCKED-OVER EVERY DAY OF MY ADULT LIFE BY MY GOVERNMENT. I served in the military when I didn't want to. I was denied college aid BECAUSE I was a veteran. I've paid $MILLIONS in income taxes over the years... AND NEVER RECEIVED A FUCKING THING FROM THE GOVERNMENT... other than what we all receive... federal highway system, federal judicial system, national defense, things like that. I some were to view my life as a "success", it wouldn't be because of what government gave me... rather it would be IN SPITE OF BEING FUCKED OVER DAILY BY MY GOVERNMENT!

Yet there are other citizens... quite a lot of them.... who don't work, don't contribute (many even commit crimes) to society... they just TAKE, AND TAKE, AND TAKE... all at MY expense. How am I supposed to appreciate that?

Wow Scataphagos : you explained REALLY well what you are going through.

I am really glad you explained that: here we are fighting some assholes special interests that are trying to turn
our country into one like your!!!! They are diverting COMMON tax money for their special interest groups.
Luckily we have some courageous folks who have been fighting alone these parasites for at least 10 years,
now thanks to testimonies like your, many are waking up and understanding that what we have is very good
and we have to fight to keep it.

THANK YOU for telling it like it is.