How to be a Guru in 10 easy Steps

Redneck · Sep 3, 2009

Quote from rolextrader:

Did Spectra teach you?

Hey Rolex

Gurus donât teach TheBestGuruEver

Heâs schooling them Sir

This thread is quite acuteâ¦.

Regards

RN

TheBestGuruEver · Sep 3, 2009

Tomorrow:

FAKE testimonials...

And if there is one guy who is did like the kool-aid, let's audit his results to see if the guru's methods can be used transferred.

odds of a guru actually teaching his holy grail to some clown.....1%.

They are the most delusional human beings on the planet...

it is like listening to a kid cry over and over for friends and money.....

they talk about everything BUT showing they make money.

it's amazing.

This is like a football quarterback talking for a billion years without EVER showing you they can throw a football. And the suckers never ask, "Can you show us you can actually throw the ball?"

great comedy.

LOL

TheBestGuruEver · Sep 6, 2009

Dear Guru,

I've tried everything and lost a lot of money. Then I used your crappy methods and made money for the first time. It's so exciting to see a trade work with your methods. I took a 5k account to 5,125 (don't put this in the testimonial). All the other gurus are all smoke and mirrors but you are the best. I was so skeptical at first....

blah, blah, blah..

Deleted Email:

Your method sucks and I lost 35,000 using your crap that might work 1 in 10 times. Is that why you do a video once every two weeks? I want my 1,500 back for your crap.

--------

You lie, suck, and i'm sure your chat room is a total scam. I can never get filled with your fake trades. Then you act like you are gone and somehow make all this money.....so why do i get all these emails from you asking for more money for education? I'm down over 100k and I can't believe I thought you were a good teacher. I fell for this scam...

-------

(9,873 emails saying the same thing)

--------

bwolinsky · Sep 6, 2009

Quote from Redneck trader:

However I (a discretionary trader) also maintain â the term positive expectancy (as define by the commonly accepted definition) â is a guru-ism â and utter BS

Regards

RN

I think we're on the same page, then. Automated systems are different, but they're the only ones I've ever trusted. Your thread makes way more sense now, having stated it's from the discretionary point of view, but sometimes it's hard to tell if the person isn't just pretending they have a system when it's discretionary in nature or requires subjective decisions to trade with. I think the guru you despise may not be the systematic ones, but the other seat of pants traders, and I do share the same sentiment with regard to gurudom.

Redneck · Sep 7, 2009

Quote from bwolinsky:

I think we're on the same page, then. Automated systems are different, but they're the only ones I've ever trusted. Your thread makes way more sense now, having stated it's from the discretionary point of view, but sometimes it's hard to tell if the person isn't just pretending they have a system when it's discretionary in nature or requires subjective decisions to trade with. I think the guru you despise may not be the systematic ones, but the other seat of pants traders, and I do share the same sentiment with regard to gurudom.

Yes â I also think we are on the same page

All discretionary traders must have defined rules to trade by (enter/ exit) â otherwise they cease to be traders and quickly become donors â capital contributors to my bottom line if you prefer

However by the very act of having/ implementing rules â a discretionary trader possibly ceases to beâ¦. or notâ¦ sort of ironic no doubt

But as with all things in life â it is up to the individual to make up their own mind on such matters..

I am a discretionary trader â who does not use discretionary tactics to enter / exit a trade â ever

On another note;

The âtotal freedomâ I described in one of my earlier posts (trading it coming/ going / in between)â¦

Could be misconstrued as a monkey sitting behind a keyboard hitting keys under the auspice of tradingâ¦.

Or

It could describe trading completely detached â simply observing â anticipating â reacting â to what is observed â without hesitation, reservation, or regret.

(maybe even described as trading with maximum efficiency and effectiveness â yep just maybe )

But again it is up to each individual to make up their own mind on such matters..

For the record the gurus I despise are;

The ones who continuously promise answers/ solutions are just over the horizon â but never deliver.

The ones who make trading appear harder than it really is. (it ainât â hell even a redneck can do it)

The ones who do not teach self-sufficiency.

The ones who have holier than thou (egotistical) attitudes.

The ones who claim the ability to train everyone/ anyone. (so exactly what power do they possess to know precisely how anyone else learns â I wonder)

The ones who profess to have unlocked the âsecrete(s)â of trading successfully, and/or guarantee profitability. (really)

The ones who teach trading, but canât/ donât trade. (if youâre going to talk the talk â then walk the damn walk â else sit down and shut up)

The ones who flat out lie / obfuscate â to take advantage of/ fleece traders.

All of these are problematic for less experienced traders, which is why threads like this are so beneficial

Now on a completely different noteâ¦.

I propose we scrutinize the most widely â and possibly the most closely held âbeliefâ

âLet winners run, cut losers shortâ¦.â (least I think this is how it goes)

Soâ¦.

Is it an absolute truth (stands on its own merit)?

Is it a guru-ism? (used to make a trader feel inferior when they do not cut a loser short, or take every available tick out of any given move â so a guru can then show them the âlightâ)

Is it something else?

Does it even pass the common sense testâ¦..?

â¦â¦ without "some" modifications?

Iâll forego posting my views for now, and instead ask for some help in classifying this oneâ¦

BTW â This examination of the âlet winners run, cut losers short" was spurred by another who posted a similar thought here â but quickly deleted itâ¦

A shame really for the only dumb question â is the one never broachedâ¦., the most debilitating act â is the one never taken..

However as I never give my ego much regardâ¦.. nor could I give a damn what others think of meâ¦. I say what the heckâ¦ letâs discussâ¦

I also know it utmost vital to have thought through the things we hold important â and to absolutely understand why we do so.

Because surely a person wouldnât hold a belief just because âmostâ doâ¦ or be afraid of being labeled a ânon-believerâ/ wrong â if one couldnât completely justify believing in something â¦. Would one???? I just wonderâ¦ I guarantee I wouldnâtâ¦

But no matter â onward we go

Regards

RN

StevenBruce · Sep 7, 2009

Here's a couple of comments for you Redneck

First, it seems to me that hardly anyone here is really interested in "education" (in learning about the profession). Instead what seems to be the case is that people here want instant solutions to their inability to trade profitably. They either want advisories, where people tell them when to pull the trigger and when to get out, or they want "setups" that work all the time (lol) or they want a system (turnkey preferred or some indicator) that they can plug-in and use like an ATM.....I get the impression that any of the above will satisfy the requirements.....

Now having been around this business for a while I know that none of the above are workable solutions for the long run. Further I know that none of offerings currently available are "real", that is to say, I don't of anything that works in the above categories, and I am pretty sure its like bigfoot (lots of stories but no evidence that it exists).

Finally I figure that the obsession with "making sure" and "getting proof" and the bashing when people can't deliver, smells to me like the tantrums that very little kids put on when they are told they can't have ice cream (or some such thing)

My point is that this whole thread reeks of infantile complaining. Seems to me that adults would simply take note of what is real and then move on to concepts that DO work (education, research, screen time, testing).

Now I figure that the more immature folks are, the more likely they are to take my comment personally, so the flames are comming I'm sure, but I also think I am pretty close to right on with my comment.

Good trading to you sir
Stevesbg

Redneck · Sep 7, 2009

Quote from stevesbg:

Here's a couple of comments for you Redneck

First, it seems to me that hardly anyone here is really interested in "education" (in learning about the profession). Instead what seems to be the case is that people here want instant solutions to their inability to trade profitably. They either want advisories, where people tell them when to pull the trigger and when to get out, or they want "setups" that work all the time (lol) or they want a system (turnkey preferred or some indicator) that they can plug-in and use like an ATM.....I get the impression that any of the above will satisfy the requirements.....

Now having been around this business for a while I know that none of the above are workable solutions for the long run. Further I know that none of offerings currently available are "real", that is to say, I don't of anything that works in the above categories, and I am pretty sure its like bigfoot (lots of stories but no evidence that it exists).

Finally I figure that the obsession with "making sure" and "getting proof" and the bashing when people can't deliver, smells to me like the tantrums that very little kids put on when they are told they can't have ice cream (or some such thing)

My point is that this whole thread reeks of infantile complaining. Seems to me that adults would simply take note of what is real and then move on to concepts that DO work (education, research, screen time, testing).

Now I figure that the more immature folks are, the more likely they are to take my comment personally, so the flames are comming I'm sure, but I also think I am pretty close to right on with my comment.

Good trading to you sir
Stevesbg

Stevesbg,

I believe you are dead nuts on Sir â give it to me now â I donât want to work for itâ¦ (Iâve never understood that mentality)

I only wish someone offered a real education about this profession â hell I would take it in a heartbeat - just because

As far as infantile complaining in this thread â¦ If I am coming across that way â it is certainly not my intention Sir

I am only trying to give folks food for thought (having been down this path myself)

Good Trading to you Sir

RN

EdgeHunter · Sep 7, 2009

Quote from Trader666:

The Jack Hershey Method of Gurudom has proven effective for over a decade:

1. Seek out locations like ET that are teeming with newbies and wannabees who have a desperate need to believe

2. Troll for followers with grandiose claims, both trading and personal

3. Peddle an incomprehensible "method" with its own jargon that can only can be learned from you or one of your stooges

4. Speak in riddles and gibberish to keep followers hanging on your every word and believing their lack of success is because they didn't grasp the full meaning of your "wisdom." This also makes the "method" nearly impossible to backtest... but if you do mistakenly state something clearly enough for others to test it, attack backtesting and whoever ran the tests

5. Constantly berate the "conventional wisdom" and "detractors"

6. Make up success stories about followers who were willing to "do the work" -- even if in reality they went down in flames

7. Never, ever do live trading or show any proof of success (because there is none)

8. Foster a cult-like atmosphere

9. Keep things fresh by promising new things on the horizon that will never materialize, like books and automated trading platforms

10. Find someone to support you so you can play pied piper full time

<font size 10>OMG... It Sounds like... Wait for it...

..... A GuruOphile</font>

TheBestGuruEver · Sep 7, 2009

Quote from Redneck trader:

Now having been around this business for a while I know that none of the above are workable solutions for the long run. Further I know that none of offerings currently available are "real", that is to say, I don't of anything that works in the above categories, and I am pretty sure its like bigfoot (lots of stories but no evidence that it exists).

Finally I figure that the obsession with "making sure" and "getting proof" and the bashing when people can't deliver, smells to me like the tantrums that very little kids put on when they are told they can't have ice cream (or some such thing)

My point is that this whole thread reeks of infantile complaining. Seems to me that adults would simply take note of what is real and then move on to concepts that DO work (education, research, screen time, testing).

Now I figure that the more immature folks are, the more likely they are to take my comment personally, so the flames are comming I'm sure, but I also think I am pretty close to right on with my comment.

RN

This is a typical guru-style selling point. For concepts TO WORK, that means they make money. Then we need proof. Screen time, research, etc... are all horrible if done wrong. bad practice over and over means bad results.

If you come back and tell me the education is FREE....then fine, I'll back off.

Then, if you come back and say we must PAY for this "education", why can't we see if it yields results?

I have a friend that can teach you how to fly a plane. What questions would you ask him before you pay him hard-earned money?

Now I have a golfer that can teach you to golf? Any questions.....?

Let's not be ridiculous.

Free education is better than nothing and then up to the individual to decipher how to fit it into his personality.

Paying for something COMPLETELY unproven is definitely wrong.

I judge value on it if WORKED. When trading WORKS, you MAKE MONEY.

Please guru, don't come back with some smoke-and-mirrors like on your website.

MandelbrotSet · Sep 7, 2009

Quote from Redneck trader:

Stevesbg,

I believe you are dead nuts on Sir â give it to me now â I donât want to work for itâ¦ (Iâve never understood that mentality)

I only wish someone offered a real education about this profession â hell I would take it in a heartbeat - just because

As far as infantile complaining in this thread â¦ If I am coming across that way â it is certainly not my intention Sir

I am only trying to give folks food for thought (having been down this path myself)

Good Trading to you Sir

RN

Stevesbg is Steve46.

He's a decent trader all-in-all, but not exactly the one to be the voice of criticism of this (EXCELLENT) thread, considering the fact that he came on this website telling some tall tale about his sister and niece getting killed in the 9/11 attacks (supposedly they jumped from one of the Towers - at least according to him). :eek:

You have to do your homework before talking to these people Redneck Trader, you get all types on these internet Trading Forums.

P.S. It's up to you to take it from here, I'm not interested in getting involved in the dreck.