Global Warming: For Experts Only

[jem]

then... show them to be dickheads by showing us peer reviewed science stating man made co2 is causing warming. (not based on models)

no one here is arguing with basic scientific principles. Science shows us co2 can warm and co2 can cool. We are talking about how man made co2 performs in a complex environment with changing levels of natural co2, negative feedbacks, positive feedbacks and sinks and probably off gassing.



2. to your second post...
CO2 is not leading any next cycle...
warming leads atmospheric co2 levels up and cooling leads atmospheric levels of co2 down.

More technically, dickhead is the name for scientists who don't believe there is scientific proof that man made co2 is causing warming as it is contrary to basic scientific principles.

Skeptical is the name for scientists who don't believe there is enough scientific evidence to predict or ascertain the exact extent to which the climate will change due to man made co2 warming. They're pedantic skeptics.

And why wouldn't they be trailing the last and leading the next

 

[jem]

I want to remind all the trolls of a post earlier in this thread... that when you find some agw whores acting like it could not be the sun... or cosmic rays

Talk to CERN.
this is why its so hard to say its CO2. Water Vapor and Clouds are hard to model and they may cause a great deal or all of the warming and cooling. And cosmic rays... may have a great deal to do with cloud formation.





https://www.forbes.com/sites/larryb...obal-warming-its-the-sun-stupid/#13c10e5266c2

Sorry, But With Global Warming It's The Sun, Stupid

....

Failing to raise any significant research support, Svensmark managed to conduct a boot-strap-funded experiment in 2007 at the Danish National Space Center that yielded convincing validation. Using a particle accelerator, he demonstrated that cosmic rays colliding with molecules in the atmosphere can, in fact, cause gaseous water vapor to condense into cloud-forming droplets. Again, he received little scientific applause for this accomplishment.

But fortunately, at least one person took the Danes' early observations seriously. Following their presentation at the Birmingham conference, CERN scientist Jasper Kirkby*, a British experimental physicist, told the scientific press in 1998 that the theory "will probably be able to account for somewhere between half and the whole of the increase in the Earth's temperature that we have seen in the last century."

Furthermore, he too, set out to obtain more proof. But his plan to do so wasn't an easy sell. It took Kirkby nearly 10 years to convince the CERN bureaucracy to create a stainless steel cloud chamber to precisely replicate the Earth's atmosphere and conduct independent experiments.

It worked! As reported in the Aug. 25 issue of the journal Nature, Jasper Kirkby and his 62 co-authors from 17 institutes in Europe and the U.S. announced that the sun indeed has a significant influence on our planet's temperature. Their "Cosmics Leaving Outdoor Droplets" (CLOUD) experiment proved that its magnetic field does, in fact, act as a gateway for cosmic rays that play a large role in cloud formation. The report stated "Ion-induced nucleation [cosmic ray action] will manifest itself as a steady production of new particles [molecular clusters] that is difficult to isolate in atmospheric observations because of other sources of variability but is nevertheless taking place and could be quite large globally over the troposphere [the lower atmosphere]." In other words, the big influence exists, yet hasn't been factored into climate models.

 

[OddTrader]

I am only a newbie but don't might to provide my guess after reading reading so many ET posts on this topic.

1. Can humans' collective efforts plus some advanced scientific technologies/inventions now/future be able to change/control something like the climate or weather or earthquake or UFO in the nature, according to what we want/expect? Probably not - Not easy at all. At least not anything significantly! The Universe is too Huge, relatively! imo

2. Could humans' collective efforts like producing more CO2 be able to adversely change our climate Beyond our control/expectation? Absolutely Yes! But we perhaps just unsure whether the potential change(s) would be a favourable trend or an unfavourable trend. That is the main problem. imo

2A. One possibility would be:
The change could be mainly/merely a shift of timing. Our normally winter months would become new summer months during a year, while normal summer months becoming extremely cold.

2B. Another possibility:
The temperature cycle would change to have new peak and new bottom every cycle. However, perhaps with a very little upwards (or downwards, depending on observation timing).

It is actually an issue of volatility! Therefore, all the supporters and the challengers of climate change can be both correct, some of the times! The usual arguments would never cease - Both sides could provide valid data sets, evidence based!

3. Should we do something for improvement and precaution? Personally, I would think yes, we should.

It's just like hedging in financial trading. Because we cannot control how low will be the lowest or highest temperature that we can still survive in that kind of extreme climate conditions. And we don't know when the worst climate would come to hurt us in the future.

Just 2 cents! LOL

Q
2017 California wildfires - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_California_wildfires - Cached
The 2017 California wildfire season was the most destructive one on record, which saw multiple wildfires burning across California. A total of 8,777 fires have burned 1,371,454 acres (5,550.08 km2), according to the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection, including five of the 20 most destructive ...
UQ

There are several moving parts that could be more significant than human induced impact to the change of climate, but we cannot weight each one of them easily nor control any one of them precisely.

It appears our earth is gradually cooling down every year. The sun is also cooling down gradually. Humans cannot even manage to counter these natural changes (cooling) by carrying out any projects scientifically in order to keep our climate being always a constant.

Fluctuations and volatility could be actually a norm. That can never be changed.

Climate change or not - Perhaps a never-ending argument! Better find an alternative constructive and positive direction/topic to spend our time, energy and efforts! :

" Men and women evolved differently but it doesn't justify gender inequality "
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-12-...erently-but-doesnt-justify-inequality/9273624

 

[futurecurrents]

Jerm, you deranged maniacal ideologue, ever find that one publishing climate scientist denying man made global warming? There are none so don't bother looking. Makes you look foolish.

We know that when asked over 97% say it's true. Google it.


Let us know when you become a publishing climate scientist. Until then STFU already.

 

[futurecurrents]

There are several moving parts that could be more significant than human induced impact to the change of climate, but we cannot weight each one of them easily nor control any one of them precisely.

It appears our earth is gradually cooling down every year. The sun is also cooling down gradually. Humans cannot even manage to counter these natural changes (cooling) by carrying out any projects scientifically in order to keep our climate being always a constant.

Fluctuations and volatility could be actually a norm. That can never be changed.

Climate change or not - Perhaps a never-ending argument! Better find an alternative constructive and positive direction/topic to spend our time, energy and efforts! :

" Men and women evolved differently but it doesn't justify gender inequality "
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-12-...erently-but-doesnt-justify-inequality/9273624

"It appears our earth is gradually cooling down every year."


Ummmm, no. LOL Wow.

 

[futurecurrents]

Groundhogs.......still more intelligent than fhl.

 

[futurecurrents]

I want to remind all the trolls of a post earlier in this thread... that when you find some agw whores acting like it could not be the sun... or cosmic rays

Talk to CERN.
this is why its so hard to say its CO2. Water Vapor and Clouds are hard to model and they may cause a great deal or all of the warming and cooling. And cosmic rays... may have a great deal to do with cloud formation.





https://www.forbes.com/sites/larryb...obal-warming-its-the-sun-stupid/#13c10e5266c2

Sorry, But With Global Warming It's The Sun, Stupid

....

Failing to raise any significant research support, Svensmark managed to conduct a boot-strap-funded experiment in 2007 at the Danish National Space Center that yielded convincing validation. Using a particle accelerator, he demonstrated that cosmic rays colliding with molecules in the atmosphere can, in fact, cause gaseous water vapor to condense into cloud-forming droplets. Again, he received little scientific applause for this accomplishment.

But fortunately, at least one person took the Danes' early observations seriously. Following their presentation at the Birmingham conference, CERN scientist Jasper Kirkby*, a British experimental physicist, told the scientific press in 1998 that the theory "will probably be able to account for somewhere between half and the whole of the increase in the Earth's temperature that we have seen in the last century."

Furthermore, he too, set out to obtain more proof. But his plan to do so wasn't an easy sell. It took Kirkby nearly 10 years to convince the CERN bureaucracy to create a stainless steel cloud chamber to precisely replicate the Earth's atmosphere and conduct independent experiments.

It worked! As reported in the Aug. 25 issue of the journal Nature, Jasper Kirkby and his 62 co-authors from 17 institutes in Europe and the U.S. announced that the sun indeed has a significant influence on our planet's temperature. Their "Cosmics Leaving Outdoor Droplets" (CLOUD) experiment proved that its magnetic field does, in fact, act as a gateway for cosmic rays that play a large role in cloud formation. The report stated "Ion-induced nucleation [cosmic ray action] will manifest itself as a steady production of new particles [molecular clusters] that is difficult to isolate in atmospheric observations because of other sources of variability but is nevertheless taking place and could be quite large globally over the troposphere [the lower atmosphere]." In other words, the big influence exists, yet hasn't been factored into climate models.

So it should be easy to find ONE publishing climate scientist that denies man made global warming.

 

[jem]

If I show you one again... will you cease posting here and apologize for being a troll ass?

So it should be easy to find ONE publishing climate scientist that denies man made global warming.

 

[OddTrader]

"It appears our earth is gradually cooling down every year."


Ummmm, no. LOL Wow.

Just curious / unsure whether the measure is related to water surface or else?

Whether the problem of plastic micro-particles would be a more meaningful/important factor affecting the ocean temperature?

Everyday day the earth temperature would become cooler, and the sun would die and become darker? Basically? That's what I learned before.

Is there any scientific research papers to analyse either the plastic micro-particles, or the CO2, or both affect sea surface temperature more than anything else?

Personally I don't think it would be easy to measure them or isolate each of them about impact of sea temperature?

My gut feeling is perhaps plastic micro-plastics would have much more weighting? Or the combination of them? Rather than the CO2 alone?

Just 2 cents! LOL

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principal_component_analysis

About 508,000 results

* Plastic fibres found in tap water around the world, study reveals ...
https://www.theguardian.com/.../plastic-fibres-found-tap-water-around-world-study-reveals
5 Sep 2017 ... Exclusive: Tests show billions of people globally are drinking water contaminated by plastic particles, with 83% of samples found to be polluted. ... How microplastics end up in drinking water is for now a mystery, but the atmosphere is one obvious source, with fibres shed by the everyday wear and tear of ...

* Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking Water
www.wakingtimes.com/.../plastic-micro-particles-now-contaminating-drinking-water/ - Cached
7 Sep 2017 ... Michael Parkes - Global drinking water supplies are now contaminated with micro plastics.

* Plastic Fibers Are Found in '83% of the World's Tap Water' | Time
time.com/4928759/plastic-fiber-tap-water-study/ - Cached
6 Sep 2017 ... Virtually all the world's tap water is contaminated by microscopic plastic fibers, a new study claims, raising fresh concerns about the implications of rampant plastic ... Some 83% of tap water samples collected from over a dozen countries on five continents tested positive for microplastic, according to a study ...

* PLASTIC MICRO PARTICLES NOW CONTAMINATING DRINKING ...
Video for Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking Water
► 5:48

8 Sep 2017 - 6 min - Uploaded by The Event Is coming soon
The Event Is Coming Soon - PLASTIC MICRO-PARTICLES NOW CONTAMINATING DRINKING ...

* Your tap water may contain plastic, researchers warn (Update)
https://phys.org/news/2017-09-plastic.html - Cached
6 Sep 2017 ... People may be ingesting between 3000 and 4000 microparticles of plastic from tap water every year, according to a study published Wednesday based ... the same plastic containers in which the samples were collected to test treated water from the lab, to rule out plastic contamination from the bottle itself.

* Images for Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking Water
Image result for Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking WaterImage result for Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking WaterImage result for Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking WaterImage result for Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking WaterImage result for Plastic Micro-Particles Now Contaminating Drinking Water

* World's drinking water contaminated with plastic fibres, study finds ...
www.euronews.com/.../worlds-drinking-water-contaminated-with-plastic-fibres-study-finds - Cached
6 Sep 2017 ... How has plastic ended up in drinking water? The way microplastics end up in drinking water is not clear. The atmosphere could be one source, with everyday objects, such as tyres, clothes and carpets emitting particles into the air. Europe is below the worldwide average of 83 percent. At 94 percent the US, ...

* Most Of The World's Tap Water Contains Plastic Fibres: Study
www.huffingtonpost.com.au/.../most-of-the-world-s-tap-water-contains-plastic-fibres-study_a_23201197/ - Cached
8 Sep 2017 ... The vast majority of the planet's tap water is contaminated by microscopic plastic fibres, a new study claims. ... The data on the impact of microplastics on humans is still lacking, but research on animals has suggested the particles can cause cancer, hormone disorders and other problems when they release ...

* If you're drinking tap water, you're consuming plastic pollutants ...
https://www.pri.org/.../if-youre-drinking-tap-water-youre-consuming-plastic-pollutants - Cached
5 Sep 2017 ... Scientists have studied how micro plastics absorb toxins they are in proximity too and how they are then taken up into the food chain in mussels and other shellfish . Credit: ... This study is the first, however, to show plastic contamination in tap water from sources around the world, according to Orb. Scientists ...

* 94% of U.S. tap water contaminated by plastic fibers — including at ...
https://www.usatoday.com/...tap-water-contaminated-plastic.../636662001/ - Cached
6 Sep 2017 ... CLOSE. Virtually all the world's tap water is contaminated by microscopic plastic fibers, a new study claims. Time ... Orb said scientists believe that most of the tiny fibers originate from clothes, upholstery and carpets, including particles released by the actions of washing machines and dryers. According to a ...

 

[OddTrader]

Just curious / unsure whether the measure is related to water surface or else?

Whether the problem of plastic micro-particles would be a more meaningful/important factor affecting the ocean temperature?

Everyday day the earth temperature would become cooler, and the sun would die and become darker? Basically? That's what I learned before.

Is there any scientific research papers to analyse either the plastic micro-particles, or the CO2, or both affect sea surface temperature more than anything else?

Personally I don't think it would be easy to measure them or isolate each of them about impact of sea temperature?

My gut feeling is perhaps plastic micro-plastics would have much more weighting? Or the combination of them? Rather than the CO2 alone?

Just 2 cents! LOL

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principal_component_analysis

Furthermore, maybe the whole earth is Already surrounded by air with plastic microbeads? That would easily cause raising temperature higher everywhere? Not cooler, I guess? LOL

About 14,800,000 results

* Scientist warns we could be breathing in microplastic particles laden ...
www.independent.co.uk/.../microplastic-microbeads-microfibres-pollution-environment-audit-committee-mps-evidence-a7021051.html - Cached - Similar
9 May 2016 ... Giving evidence to the House of Commons Environmental Audit Committee, Professor Frank Kelly, an expert in environmental health from King's College London, said researchers at his centre had just begun a study into whether tiny plastic particles in the air were a significant problem. Plastic microbeads ...

* People may be breathing in microplastics, health expert warns ...
https://www.theguardian.com/.../people-may-be-breathing-in-microplastics-health-expert-warns - Cached - Similar
9 May 2016 ... People could be breathing in microparticles of plastic, according to a leading environmental health expert, with as yet unknown consequences on health. ... But Frank Kelly, a professor of environmental health at King’s College London, told MPs investigating the issue that the ...

* Plastic fibres found in tap water around the world, study reveals ...
https://www.theguardian.com/.../plastic-fibres-found-tap-water-around-world-study-reveals
5 Sep 2017 ... How microplastics end up in drinking water is for now a mystery, but the atmosphere is one obvious source, with fibres shed by the everyday wear and tear of clothes and carpets. Tumble dryers are another potential source, with almost 80% of US households having dryers that usually vent to the open air.

* Assuring quality in microplastic monitoring: About the value of clean ...
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-05838-4
14 Jul 2017 ... Avoiding aerial microfibre contamination of environmental samples is essential for reliable analyses when it comes to the detection of ubiquitous microplastics. Almost all laboratories have contamination problems which are largely unavoidable without investments in clean-air devices. Therefore, our study ...

* Microplastics - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microplastics - Cached - Similar
Microplastic "scrubbers", used in exfoliating hand cleansers and facial scrubs, have replaced traditionally used natural ingredients, including ground almonds, oatmeal and pumice. Primary microplastics have also been produced for use in air blasting technology. This process involves blasting acrylic, melamine or polyester ...
‎Classification - ‎Primary microplastics - ‎Secondary microplastics - ‎Sources

* First overview of microplastics in indoor and outdoor air
https://www.researchgate.net/.../281657363_First_overview_of_microplastics_in_indoor_and_outdoor_air - Similar
Because of their small size and their properties, MPs can be accumulated in the environment leading to a potential MP exposure of biota undergoing bioaccumulation and biological effects ( Barnes et al., 2009;Wright et al., 2013). The occurrence of MPs was reported in continental environments: air ( Gasperi et al., 2015), ...

* First overview of microplastics in indoor and outdoor air - HAL-ENPC
https://hal-enpc.archives-ouvertes.fr/hal-01195546 - Cached
Abstract : The plastic production has increased rapidly from 1.7 to 288 million tons annually within the last 60 years (PlasticsEurope 2013). In the early 70's, the presence of millimetric plastic debris in marine environment has been highlighted and more recently the term microplastics was used to describe millimetric and ...

* Microplastics Are Infiltrating Nearly Every Body of Water — NOVA ...
www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/next/earth/freshwater-microplastics/ - Cached
11 May 2017 ... They could also settle out of the air as they shed from clothing, carpets, and other textiles in everyday use. Microfibers could also escape as lint from dryer vents. A small study in Paris found that anywhere from one and a half to 297 plastic particles fell from the sky per square yard per day, which could mean ...

* “We may breathe harmful microplastics" - Plastic Soup Foundation
https://www.plasticsoupfoundation.org/.../breathe-harmful-microplastics/ - Cached
11 May 2016 ... Microplastics in the air are potentially dangerous for human health. Professor Kelly of King's College London: “If we breathe them in they could potentially deliver chemicals to the lower parts of our lungs and maybe even across into our circulation, in the same way as we worry about all the other ...