From rags to riches, 700$ to 100k in 2013

Quote from Look4aSine:

The statement "Trading is Gambling" is an example of "Affirming the Consequent":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirming_the_consequent


So, the logic is flawed by saying:


The truth is:
Gambling is participation in high-risk activities that are easily avoidable.
Professional Trading is to avoid taking on any high-risk positions.
Therefore, to claim that "Trading is Gambling" is to prove you are still an Amateur.

"A bad workman blames his tools."
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Gambling is not participation in high-risk activities, it is engaging in speculative activities with an uncertain outcome.

Eighteen years ago I was in a country where the four digit lottery had stakes of roughly 35 cents yielding a return of about $700. I never thought of that as high risk given the very low stake and the absolute irrelevance of the outcome to my financial situation.
 
Quote from SeventhCereal:

After 20+ pages this is seriously starting to look like the cheap tables at a casino where all the people with dirty clothes go to blow their paychecks and egg each other.
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Sire, the peasants are revolting!

Tell them to take a bath.
 
When comparing gambling to investing, the isssues to consider are those of "probability and time".
If you are making very low probability trades, in the HOPE of a higher potential % return, you are gambling.
That type of trade can work in your favor for a period of time.
But "over time", just like casino gambling.... low probablity trades will NOT work out in your favor.

It's one thing to make the occasional low probability trade.
It's another to do it with "consistency" as a prefered strategy.
The more frequently you do them, and the longer time frame you do them, the sooner your funds will be wipped out.
Just like in a casino.
:mad:
 
Quote from Put_Master:

When comparing gambling to investing, the isssues to consider are those of "probability and time".
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Sure, if you want to curve-fit Trading/Investing into being called Gambling.

The real issue to consider as proof that it is *not* gambling is "control", especially "self-control".
Meaning, that Trading without self-"control" IS gambling.
The Mars Rover without NASA-engineered back-up "controls" IS gambling.
New Orleans without flood "control" IS gambling.

But, will NASA avoid all problems? NO
Will New Orleans avoid all hurricanes? NO
Does every successful Trader's trade make money? NO
So what, that is not proof they are Gambling.

Otherwise, you're gambling if you drive.
You're gambling if you go swimming.
You're gambling if you breath.

Get real.

Gambling is when you choose to not be in control.
 
Quote from cygnetnoir:

...What, in your opinion, distinguishes the trader from the gambler so as to set the trader apart as something other than a gambler? What qualitative difference is there between the pro trader who plays his or her edge in the futures market day after day that makes his activity different in kind from the pro card player who plays his or her edge in the casinos and card parlors day after day?

This is not a rhetorical question. And you will not be able to answer it without changing commonly accepted definitions or violating principles of logic.
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No one will be able to provide an answer to this question that satisfies the requirements of logic without resorting to changing the meaning of the terms. Gambling is, by definition, the betting of something of value, e.g. money on a contingency or an uncertain outcome.

Many games of chance have no edge available to the player against the house (casino, the market). Some games of chance have quite an edge available for those with the skill, talent, and emotional control required to play one's edge in the face of risk.

Trading is always, no matter how well researched, no matter how tightly controlled the risk, a bet on a contingency, a risk of loss or profit based upon an uncertain outcome. Trading is gambling.
 
I think you confuse "uncertain outcome" with your "uncertain profit/loss".
The stock market has many certainties, all of which have nothing to do with your P/L.
Here are the basics:

1) Stocks go up.
2) Stocks go down.
3) Stocks go flat.
4) Stocks never go up forever.
5) Stocks never go down forever.
6) Stocks never stay flat forever.
7) Stocks transition from going up, down, or flat.

A) Stocks do not have expiration dates.
B) Options have expiration dates.

I can do the same with driving a car:

1) Cars go forward.
2) Cars go reverse.
3) Cars turn left.
4) Cars turn right.
5) Cars run out of gas and stop going anywhere.

A) Vans hold 10 people.
B) Trucks hold 3 people.

"Control" or lack of "control" makes something gambling.
If you are an out-of-control drunk and choose to drive, then you gamble with your life.
The choice to drive a car is not gambling, but the choice not to be in control IS.

As for the stock market, finding how to gain control is the challenge.
Fear and Greed are powerful obstacles.
It is said, "If Trading makes you excited, then you are not doing it right".
But for wealthy investors of the world, it is like driving a car.
What? You think they are going to gamble with their wealth?
Where do you think your losses are going? Into thin air?
No. Into their pockets, as in - "The rich get richer".
 
Quote from cygnetnoir:
Trading is always, no matter how well researched, no matter how tightly controlled the risk, a bet on a contingency, a risk of loss or profit based upon an uncertain outcome. Trading is gambling.
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Any business is a gamble. How is trading different from an internet start-up or a corner grocery store? All of these are speculations/bets where capital is committed and the outcome is uncertain.
 
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