this is the problem and why I was voting for cruz.
Ann Coulter better straighten this out fast.
Ann Coulter better straighten this out fast.
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Fact checking Trump stances
- Thread starter nitro
- Start date
Who wouldn't love the chart? It indicates crime has fallen, that's a good thing regardless. Yes, it's tragic how incarceration parallels socioeconomic status, but that's not a secret for either side.The left loves this chart. What they don't love is the chart that shows the dramatic increase of black men in the prison system over the exact same period, and then trying to explain that there is no coloration between the two.
My point, and that of the OP, is that the low hanging fruit is gone. You want to spend big dollars on a wall, and spend big dollars on the wall's staffing and maintenance, to solve one of our lesser problems.would close to 1.4 million non immigration offenses have been committed if illegal aliens had been kept out of the country or not.
- An estimated 25,000 of these undocumented immigrants serving sentences for homicide
- A cumulative total of 2.89 million offenses committed by these undocumented immigrants between 2003 and 2009 (although half a million of these were for immigration-related offenses)
- Among those offenses: An estimated 42,000 robberies, 70,000 sex crimes, 81,000 auto thefts, 95,000 weapons offenses, and 213,000 assaults
so is that more crime or less crime.
its not like for ever illegal alien criminal we brought in we shipped a citizen criminal out. We kept both.
Perfection is prohibitively expensive.
bunk... for multiple reasons.
first we will take your argument..
1. if you wish to look at this from a financial perspective... which is not my point but yours... as a business man would you pay 10 or whatever the number today is to save a multiple of that each and every year.
2. I am concerned about immigration in part to stop terrorists acts like the one we had in San Bernadino recently... or in Europe or the twin towers. We are talking priceless lives and how many trillions have we spent in response to the twin towers. That i one reason I think we need to halt immigration for now.
If you wish to look at this in cost to Americans you lose every way up or down in or out.
3. There is only one legit argument for your side... and no one on your side is arguing it well. even the Pope total mangles it.. However, the counter to that argument ends the conversation.
4. In the end the crooked leaders destroying the countries creating the immigrants would have to be held responsible.
But rather than having world leadership from the UN on down helping the people in their home countries and demand responsible leadership from their leaders regardless of their oil or religion... we have America and European leaders creating a remedy which will lead to the collapse of western nations.
So I ask are you happy with the end game and who is pulling the levers on these polticians?
first we will take your argument..
1. if you wish to look at this from a financial perspective... which is not my point but yours... as a business man would you pay 10 or whatever the number today is to save a multiple of that each and every year.
2. I am concerned about immigration in part to stop terrorists acts like the one we had in San Bernadino recently... or in Europe or the twin towers. We are talking priceless lives and how many trillions have we spent in response to the twin towers. That i one reason I think we need to halt immigration for now.
If you wish to look at this in cost to Americans you lose every way up or down in or out.
3. There is only one legit argument for your side... and no one on your side is arguing it well. even the Pope total mangles it.. However, the counter to that argument ends the conversation.
4. In the end the crooked leaders destroying the countries creating the immigrants would have to be held responsible.
But rather than having world leadership from the UN on down helping the people in their home countries and demand responsible leadership from their leaders regardless of their oil or religion... we have America and European leaders creating a remedy which will lead to the collapse of western nations.
So I ask are you happy with the end game and who is pulling the levers on these polticians?
My point, and that of the OP, is that the low hanging fruit is gone. You want to spend big dollars on a wall, and spend big dollars on the wall's staffing and maintenance, to solve one of our lesser problems.
Perfection is prohibitively expensive.
I've watched most of trumps speeches and interviews. He's moving to the Center and softening rehtoric to court independents and Bernie supporters. Trump has been emphatic about the wall and trade countless times. If he turns judas and double crosses the American people, he will go down as one of most reviled traitors of all time. Then we throw his bitch ass out and start fresh. As it stands now I highly doubt a betrayal of voters is trumps end game. Just in some pathetic attempt to gain power. Makes no sense. Read his interviews from 25 years ago. His attitudes towards illegal immigration and trade were the exact same. He's a good bet
What I'm saying is that I believe the ROI is negative. Even factoring #2, I believe the probability per unit time to be low, the probable scale to be low, and so the potential return per unit time to be negative. Sure, we can't "put a price on human life", but... we can and must.1. if you wish to look at this from a financial perspective... which is not my point but yours... as a business man would you pay 10 or whatever the number today is to save a multiple of that each and every year.
2. I am concerned about immigration in part to stop terrorists acts like the one we had in San Bernadino recently... or in Europe or the twin towers. We are talking priceless lives and how many trillions have we spent in response to the twin towers. That i one reason I think we need to halt immigration for now.
Instead spend the (new) wall's construction cost, and the staffing and maintenance cost, on our infrastructure, physical and cultural.
again... I am saying lives are priceless and you the lefty are trying to do financial cost benefit analysis.
But... here is the cost benefit analysis showing you to be very wrong.
http://www.heritage.org/research/re...ful-immigrants-and-amnesty-to-the-us-taxpayer
you are wrong by $592,000 minus about $10,000 per illegal immigrant minus the time value of money and the cost of the wall. And that is not including the costs of the prevention of terrorism.
Then we can talk about future legal immigrants which are largely going to be the same costs per person.
I say lets change that for the immigrants already here and stop immigration til we have jobs for all these people and we give them real shot at the American dream.
But... here is the cost benefit analysis showing you to be very wrong.
http://www.heritage.org/research/re...ful-immigrants-and-amnesty-to-the-us-taxpayer
you are wrong by $592,000 minus about $10,000 per illegal immigrant minus the time value of money and the cost of the wall. And that is not including the costs of the prevention of terrorism.
Then we can talk about future legal immigrants which are largely going to be the same costs per person.
I say lets change that for the immigrants already here and stop immigration til we have jobs for all these people and we give them real shot at the American dream.
What I'm saying is that I believe the ROI is negative. Even factoring #2, I believe the probability per unit time to be low, the probable scale to be low, and so the potential return per unit time to be negative. Sure, we can't "put a price on human life", but... we can and must.
Instead spend the (new) wall's construction cost, and the staffing and maintenance cost, on our infrastructure, physical and cultural.