Evolution debunked in 1 paragraph.

[Free Thinker]

Quote from jem:

From what I can tell...

apparently hawking just guesses and doesn't understand science as well as Stu.

" As Stephen Hawking has noted, "The laws of science, as we know them at present, contain many fundamental numbers, like the size of the electric charge of the electron and the ratio of the masses of the proton and the electron. ... The remarkable fact is that the values of these numbers seem to have been very finely adjusted to make possible the development of life."[4]"

---


I hope the readers understand that - other than the multi universe hypothesis - it seems credible scientists have not made the claim that random chance caused the universe in decades and the one that did write about it in a peer reviewed paper, - issued a retraction.

Stu and the et atheists are spouting brain dead science.

lets say that there is an all knowing all powerful god capable of designing the universe and the bible is the work of this god.

what would you expect to find if you open this book? it should contain all the knowledge of the universe. an explaination of gravity should be in there. all the laws of physics should be in there. the cures for all diseases that cause pain and death for mankind should be there. it should be a book of beauty and knowledge.
but what do we really find? we find a bunch of gibberish that seems to be written superstitious men. there is a part about god making man out of dirt. there is another part about god making a woman by taking a rib out of a man. there is a part about some men trying to build a stone tower to heaven which angered god so he dispersed after making them not able to understand each other. there is a part about a giant fish swallowing a man and spitting him up a week later unharmed. there is another part about some men walking in a fire unharmed. there is another part about getting bitten by poisonous snakes and not harmed.

jem if it werent so sad that people like you believe this crap it almost be funny. and you call other people brain dead.

 

[Betapeg]

Quote from Free Thinker:

lets say that there is an all knowing all powerful god capable of designing the universe and the bible is the work of this god.

what would you expect to find if you open this book? it should contain all the knowledge of the universe. an explaination of gravity should be in there. all the laws of physics should be in there. the cures for all diseases that cause pain and death for mankind should be there. it should be a book of beauty and knowledge.
but what do we really find? we find a bunch of gibberish that seems to be written superstitious men. there is a part about god making man out of dirt. there is another part about god making a woman by taking a rib out of a man. there is a part about some men trying to build a stone tower to heaven which angered god so he dispersed after making them not able to understand each other. there is a part about a giant fish swallowing a man and spitting him up a week later unharmed. there is another part about some men walking in a fire unharmed. there is another part about getting bitten by poisonous snakes and not harmed.

jem if it werent so sad that people like you believe this crap it almost be funny. and you call other people brain dead.

Don't forget the parts about talking animals, multi-headed beasts coming out of the ocean, a 6 day creation of the universe, genocide, and enough capital punishment that makes North Korea look like a hippy commune.

 

[jem]

Quote from Betapeg:

Key word, "seem". He did not say they were adjusted just so our form of life could exist. Let's get past this blasphemy of Stephen Hawking's views, shall we? Here is what he really believes.

===========================================

In his latest book, The Grand Design, an extract of which is published in Eureka magazine in The Times, Hawking said: “Because there is a law such as gravity, the Universe can and will create itself from nothing. Spontaneous creation is the reason there is something rather than nothing, why the Universe exists, why we exist.”

In his new book he rejects Sir Isaac Newton's theory that the Universe did not spontaneously begin to form but was set in motion by God.

In June this year Prof Hawking told a Channel 4 series that he didn't believe that a "personal" God existed. He told Genius of Britain: "The question is: is the way the universe began chosen by God for reasons we can't understand, or was it determined by a law of science? I believe the second. If you like, you can call the laws of science 'God', but it wouldn't be a personal God that you could meet, and ask questions."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/...od-was-not-needed-to-create-the-Universe.html

"I have lived with the prospect of an early death for the last 49 years. I'm not afraid of death, but I'm in no hurry to die. I have so much I want to do first. I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark.”

"The question is: is the way the universe began chosen by God for reasons we can't understand, or was it determined by a law of science? I believe the second. If you like, you can call the laws of science 'God', but it wouldn't be a personal God that you could meet, and ask questions."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/...airy-story-for-people-afraid-of-the-dark.html



What an absolutely ridiculous lie. Chaos Theory explains in vivid detail how random our universe really is and how order can come from such randomness.

chaos theory - are you really familiar with chaos theory...

how does chaos theory explain that random chance produced the universe... if you are going to quote dawkins and his book please note that I have seen dawkins speak... (on t.v.) and I have produced quotes from him here on et.... he admits that as of now science has no explanation for the fine tunings of our universe... other than to suggest that there could be almost infinite other universes.


regarding hawking and his book... if you look at the other quotes in his new book you will see that - hawking states our one universe still appears designed but that since string theory allows for almost infinite other universes... then the fine tunings in our universe do not need to one having to conclude design.

by the way... I have been strugling with the idea that you quoted.

how exactly would the universe spontaneously create itself... initially?


I understand that if you have trillions of universes... ours would be created by the laws of science...

but what causes that initial... did hawking explain that in his book?

 

[jem]

Quote from Free Thinker:

lets say that there is an all knowing all powerful god capable of designing the universe and the bible is the work of this god.

what would you expect to find if you open this book? it should contain all the knowledge of the universe. an explaination of gravity should be in there. all the laws of physics should be in there. the cures for all diseases that cause pain and death for mankind should be there. it should be a book of beauty and knowledge.
but what do we really find? we find a bunch of gibberish that seems to be written superstitious men. there is a part about god making man out of dirt. there is another part about god making a woman by taking a rib out of a man. there is a part about some men trying to build a stone tower to heaven which angered god so he dispersed after making them not able to understand each other. there is a part about a giant fish swallowing a man and spitting him up a week later unharmed. there is another part about some men walking in a fire unharmed. there is another part about getting bitten by poisonous snakes and not harmed.

jem if it werent so sad that people like you believe this crap it almost be funny. and you call other people brain dead.

you keep confusing arguments about design and the bible?
do you do that on purpose? are you too emotional to understand the difference.

the threshold question is - is there evidence of a design... if you say yes then you can argue about a specific designer.

I am not arguing there is evidence of a specific designer so why do you keep bringing up the bible.

 

[Gabfly1]

Quote from jem:

...are you too emotional to understand the difference.

the threshold question is - is there evidence of a designer...

And are you "too emotional" to understand the difference between the mere appearance of a designer as compared to the evidence of one? Evolutionary science is replete with examples of bottom-up tweaking as compared to top-down design. And some examples of this apparent "design" appear downright unintelligent because of evolution's work-in-progress nature through the eons, let alone the millenia.

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from jem:

you keep confusing arguments about design and the bible?
do you do that on purpose? are you too emotional to understand the difference.

the threshold question is - is there evidence of a design... if you say yes then you can argue about a specific designer.

I am not arguing there is evidence of a specific designer so why do you keep bringing up the bible.

then you should know that there is no evidence of design. there is only a gap in our knowledge that people like you try to place your god.

 

[Ricter]

Quote from Free Thinker:

then you should know that there is no evidence of design.

The evidence is the feeling that there is a designer, but I don't think we're (well, not me, but for argument's sake...) using the same definition of evidence that you are.

 

[stu]

Quote from Ricter:

The evidence is the feeling that there is a designer, but I don't think we're (well, not me, but for argument's sake...) using the same definition of evidence that you are.

That would be the same evidence as in the feeling that the earth is flat.
Seems the less evidence there is of any kind, the more superstition about an intelligent designer can get a hold.

 

[Betapeg]

Quote from jem:

chaos theory - are you really familiar with chaos theory...

how does chaos theory explain that random chance produced the universe... if you are going to quote dawkins and his book please note that I have seen dawkins speak... (on t.v.) and I have produced quotes from him here on et.... he admits that as of now science has no explanation for the fine tunings of our universe... other than to suggest that there could be almost infinite other universes.

My point was, order can come from randomness. Chaos Theory explains this fact. Evolution fits perfectly into this natural principle.

regarding hawking and his book... if you look at the other quotes in his new book you will see that - hawking states our one universe still appears designed but that since string theory allows for almost infinite other universes... then the fine tunings in our universe do not need to one having to conclude design.

The appearance of design is not evidence of design. I think Hawking understands this fact very well.

by the way... I have been strugling with the idea that you quoted.

how exactly would the universe spontaneously create itself... initially?

I understand that if you have trillions of universes... ours would be created by the laws of science...

but what causes that initial... did hawking explain that in his book?

Why does there have to be a cause? You must understand that the cause-&-effect relationship that you are used to did not exist at the moment of creation. There was no time, space, cause and effect, etc. The laws of physics as we know them did not even exist. Therefore, there needn't be a cause.

But if you demand a theory on it, you've probably (judging by your post) have already seen some. M-Theory would say two branes collided culminating in a Big Bang. Whatever the theory, it certainly beats a "God did it" argument, which explains everything and yet, absolutely nothing. Why do we have day and night? "God did it." Does that really explain anything? No, there is a REASON why we have day and night (earth spins on an axis). God of the Gaps is a failure of human reasoning, pure and simple.

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from Ricter:

The evidence is the feeling that there is a designer, but I don't think we're (well, not me, but for argument's sake...) using the same definition of evidence that you are.

when one person "feels" that little green men created the universe and the other "feels" that the christian god created the universe what criteria would you use to determine which if any might be true?