If they overthrow the Hamas, they will be completely at the mercy of the Israelis who practice overt discrimination against them anyway. How will they have a good life for their people? The Israelis will throw them a few bones here and there but their lot in life will hardly improve much.
Evil Doers blow up university students
- Thread starter candletrader
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If they overthrow the Hamas, they will be completely at the mercy of the Israelis who practice overt discrimination against them anyway. How will they have a good life for their people? The Israelis will throw them a few bones here and there but their lot in life will hardly improve much.
YOu are right...Begin was a terrorist. I never said that the Israelis were blameless. All I ever meant was that AS THINGS ARE NOW, the israeli palestinians are getting a better shake than the ones who fled with empty promises from the arab leaders that told them to leave in '48 and that they would just be able to stroll back in after israel was defeated. And that the refugees are still treated like dogs in the camps set up for them outside of israel. None of the arab nations have or will accept them. They are kept in the camps, with no chance of assimilating.
There are certainly a lot of disgraceful events in israels history. Lots of criminals, terrorists, and shame. No doubt about it.
OK whatever you say.
So far it doesn't seem to matter what the subject is. If I say white, you say black. I will always be wrong about everything with you. And that to me is a good thing!
However, you say "their lot in life will HARDLY IMPROVE MUCH"...so you agree that it will improve? Or was this just a typo on your behalf.
Anyway, I didn't suggest that overthrowing Hamas and replacing Arafat should include living under Israeli control. I said if they got real and had reputable leaders who cared about the people, they would have their own country. They wouldn't need Israel to "throw them bones". They could join the world if they put 1% of their effort into education as opposed to hatred and bloodshed. ( I mean the leaders....I really believe that for the most part the palestinians have no interest in anything other than being able to provide for their families...which is not a priority for arafat, hamas, jihad, etc.)
Why would the Palestinians beg for bones from the Israelis. Are you saying they are too weak or stupid to provide for themselves?
The Jews entered that land in the 1940's with practically nothing. They organized, set up farms to grow food, built up industries and businesses and schools slowly over the years and all in all through hard work and dedication provided for themselves. The typical Israeli is wealthy by most standards. Are you saying the Palestinians are inferior to the Israelis? I don't believe they are. The only thing holding them back are men like Arafat who are armed and feed off of violence and chaos. Without it they would be powerless and they know it. They've been "rallying the people" to "kill the evil Jews" for over 50 years instead of working on providing for their families and their futures and look at what it's got them. They owe it all to the leaders they have permitted to stay in power. They have to wise up sometime, don't they?
What are you talking about? I agree with what you say here. I never said anything to imply I felt differently. You just want to argue? Even if we agree? I can't win with you....not that I want to .... you just love to argue. You must miss Darkhorse terribly.
I clearly said that the palestinians living in israel were better off than those who are suffering in the refugee camps in the arab nations that will not accept them!
The palestinians who live and have citizenship rights in Israel (the Green Line Israel) are indeed law abiding and productive citizens.
Good Post, you've hit on some of the core issues that no one in the media is talking about.
I think what we're really seeing here is a clash of economic ideologies rather than religious ideologies.
As a culture the Israeli's are a very hard working lot, that put work and success above quality of life (very much like Americans).
The Palestinians, on the other hand, believe in a quality of life ideology (very much like Europeans). They're not week or stupid, they just believe life should be lived differently.
There is no right answer. Both are entitled to live life as they wish; however, the economies of the two cultures are so integrally linked, that it is not possible for Palestinian's to live the quality of life which they believe in because they must work like an Israeli to survive.
In effect the Israeli's economy is forcing the Palestinians to become Israeli (in a sense).
With an Ocean dividing the US and European economies its easy for these divergent philosophies to exist. American's work more and they make more money, consequently the US economy is stronger (of course we also have higher rates of heart attacks, cancer, drunk driving, etc. etc.). Euro's average 4-6 weeks of vacation a year, work 35 hours a week, and make substantially less wages relative to their cost of living. None of this is a problem because the European and American cultures don't live right on top of one another. We peacefully exist because we have a large Ocean that keeps our economies from intermingling on a daily basis.
The real problem here is Capitalism. Believe me I'm very Republican, but I'm starting to realize that Capitalism has its short comings and we need to find a better way to resolve these issues.
As for Arafat, what can I say. He is doing nothing for anyone's cause except his own. If the Palestinians want to be taken seriously they need to get rid of that guy.
Well, well, well, congratulations Candleman, you've certainly been doing some homework. Glad to see I'm not the only one interested in exposing Islam for the evil BS that it is. (Here's that link again: http://main.faithfreedom.org)
Certainly, let's widen the discussion. For starters, I suggest you open your eyes - and stop being a hypocrite - and fairly judge your own holy book, the Bible, on its merits!
To help you out, here are some links: www.atheists.org www.infidel.org www.skepticsannotatedbible.com
Hopefully the realisation will be that, on a global scale, religion only helps to breed mistrust and hatred, and, on a personal level, stifles freedom of thought and the pursuit of individual happiness.
Only secular, humanist governance offers the world the chance for peace, co-operation and prosperity.
Part of its the media.They have made up a story when they didnt have one.[NBC news got caught firing a rocket into a pickup truck-'faulty side gas tank'' news story, years ago.
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In recognition of the Wall Street Journal, Investors Business Daily, don't think they are like that.
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In recognition of the Wall Street Journal, Investors Business Daily, don't think they are like that.