Electric battery raw materials vs. electric coins as investment

[Pekelo]

In this thread I will propose that as a long term (5+ years) investment any raw materials that has to do with battery making will HUGELY outperform electric coins, aka crypto. There should probably be a raw material ETF...

Lithium, cobalt and nickel are actually rare unlike cryptos and the demand for them is going to hit the roof as most everybody is switching to EV making. But don't believe me, read the expert's opinion:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/rivian...electric-vehicle-battery-shortage-11650276000

Rivian Automotive Inc. Chief Executive RJ Scaringe is warning that the auto industry could soon face a shortage of battery supplies for electric vehicles—a challenge that he says could surpass the current computer-chip shortage.

Car companies are trying to lock up limited supplies of raw materials such as cobalt, lithium and nickel that are key to battery making, and many are constructing their own battery plants to put more battery-powered models in showrooms.

 

[Fain]

Picks and Shovels play, I'm doing private placements in these to maximize my upside in the junior mining and exploration. Lithium, Graphite, Manganese so far. No cobalt or nickel yet.

 

[GlobalMacro90]

Could be, there certainly should be huge demand for this stuff. Id like to be long both.

I know ur a well-known crypto hater and you are kicking the hornet's nest on purpose but ill bite ... "Lithium, cobalt and nickel are actually rare unlike cryptos " you know that BS.

Sure there are unlimited "cryptos" just like there are practically unlimited metals on earth. There is a limited supply of gold tho. Bitcoin is the same way, except there is a hard, unchangeable limit on bitcoin not just small supply growth "like gold"

the fact there there can be unlimited cryptos doesn't negate bitcoins scarcity

and no bitcoins 21M cap will never be changed. understanding what that would take would make it obvioius that never changes.

 

[Pekelo]

1. there are practically unlimited metals on earth. There is a limited supply of gold tho.

2. the fact there there can be unlimited cryptos doesn't negate bitcoins scarcity

3. and no bitcoins 21M cap will never be changed.

1.Holy fuck, the ignorance...And you contradicted yourself with the follow up sentence. And practical in this case means economically feasible.
2. Bitcoin is practically not scarce, stop believing lies. Forks exist, and see point #3.
3. You can't state that because the hard limit can be CHANGED by consensus.
4. Furthermore cryptos are valuable because of FOMO and hype, not because they are rare.


Anyhow this is more of an investment thread about raw materials then me teaching you basic crypto knowledge...

 

[M.W.]

It's hilarious to believe bitcoins are rare and hence hold value. It's a purely speculative instrument, nothing else. You can infinitely increase the virtual amount of bitcoin in circulation by ever splitting into smaller units. That's the same as not splitting and instead increasing the supply. How that simple math does not get into some heads is outright bewildering.

Could be, there certainly should be huge demand for this stuff. Id like to be long both.

I know ur a well-known crypto hater and you are kicking the hornet's nest on purpose but ill bite ... "Lithium, cobalt and nickel are actually rare unlike cryptos " you know that BS.

Sure there are unlimited "cryptos" just like there are practically unlimited metals on earth. There is a limited supply of gold tho. Bitcoin is the same way, except there is a hard, unchangeable limit on bitcoin not just small supply growth "like gold"

the fact there there can be unlimited cryptos doesn't negate bitcoins scarcity

and no bitcoins 21M cap will never be changed. understanding what that would take would make it obvioius that never changes.

 

[GlobalMacro90]

This is so dumb. Keep thinking you know everything and keep missing out.

Forks are not bitcoin dude. It's completely different. Bitcoin SV for example is a fork of bitcoin. It currently has a market cap of 1.6BB. Real bitcoin has a market cap of 800BB. Saying fork exists so bitcoin isn't scarce really shows a lack of understanding.

If I hacked into Facebook and copied their source code I can make a new website, facebook2. HOWEVER facebook2 would have no users, no network, no advertising revenue, and no value. This is what forks of bitcoin essentially are.

Right, it can be changed by consensus. I also said if you thought about the mechanics of this it's basically impossible. It would take the majority of bitcoin holders/miners/full node operators to change the protocol to MAKE THE VALUE OF THEIR CURRENT HOLDING WORTH LESS (by increasing the supply cap). No way this happens.

Wake the fuck up

 

[GlobalMacro90]

It's hilarious to believe bitcoins are rare and hence hold value. It's a purely speculative instrument, nothing else. You can infinitely increase the virtual amount of bitcoin in circulation by ever splitting into smaller units. That's the same as not splitting and instead increasing the supply. How that simple math does not get into some heads is outright bewildering.

Qre you serious? If I split a dollar into 1000 pieces (10% of a penny) does that mean there are less dollar in circulation?

"It's a purely speculative instrument, nothing else." now that is hysterical. Look around man.

 

[M.W.]

You are blatantly ignoring the fact that after splitting the value of each new unit can and does change. If 1 bitcoin buys a loaf of bread today and you then split it 10:1 and 0.1 bitcoin tomorrow also buys a loaf of bread then effectively the supply of bitcoin increased 10 fold even though the absolute amount of bitcoin remains unchanged. Think before you make stupid comments.

As you can see one can increase the purchasing power of bitcoin in the exact same way than printing money for fiat currencies just through different means. Note that I don't speak of inflation. My statement was on purchasing power and units in circulation,not absolute bitcoin in circulation. We have seen that with other nations who deliberately shaved a few zeros off their notes in circulation without increasing the absolute amount in circulation.

Inflation is not always caused by more money in circulation as can be seen in the case of Japan. BOJ has flooded the market with yen and yet they report 2% inflation when we see 7 or 8 percent. The reason is that Japan that not experience wage inflation and more importantly corporates hardly ever pass on production cost increases to customers. In the west a huge amount of the work force dropped out and handouts made it unattractive to work low wage jobs. This increased labor costs and companies in the west are much more eager to pass on their costs of production through price increases in products leading to price inflation.

Qre you serious? If I split a dollar into 1000 pieces (10% of a penny) does that mean there are less dollar in circulation?

"It's a purely speculative instrument, nothing else." now that is hysterical. Look around man.

 

[Pekelo]

Forks are not bitcoin dude. It's completely different.

Depends on how I improve the fork. Most forks are usually an IMPROVEMENT on your obsolete Bitcoin, but that is not the point. Imagine I could make diamonds at WILL with my 3D printer or microwave. Would you call diamonds rare then? (they are not rare anyway, so you can use anything in this example)

But because of the easiness of forking, you can't claim uniqueness or rarity. For the original purpose of bitcoin (decentralized money) any forked crypto will just do FINE. The only reason crypto fans I mean investors are sticking to BTC is because that is their chosen ponzi.

Hell the first fork Litecoin was an immediate improvement on a bad idea and took I think an hour to create.

So let's end this silly argument because I have to microwave some diamonds. Now be a good boy, and buy some cobalt futures.

 

[Sprout]

In this thread I will propose that as a long term (5+ years) investment any raw materials that has to do with battery making will HUGELY outperform electric coins, aka crypto. There should probably be a raw material ETF...

Lithium, cobalt and nickel are actually rare unlike cryptos and the demand for them is going to hit the roof as most everybody is switching to EV making. But don't believe me, read the expert's opinion:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/rivian...electric-vehicle-battery-shortage-11650276000

Rivian Automotive Inc. Chief Executive RJ Scaringe is warning that the auto industry could soon face a shortage of battery supplies for electric vehicles—a challenge that he says could surpass the current computer-chip shortage.

Car companies are trying to lock up limited supplies of raw materials such as cobalt, lithium and nickel that are key to battery making, and many are constructing their own battery plants to put more battery-powered models in showrooms.

Lot's of background by a miner of 30yrs

https://twitter.com/x/status/1509228228019466243