Debtor prisons are back

logic_man · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from SREC:

You should try reading the article. She did not owe the debt, she was billed in error.

As I pointed out a couple of pages ago, I know. The discussion then turned to the idea of putting people in prison for debts they try to avoid. If you could keep up, that'd be great.

oldtime · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from logic_man:

Hmm...grass hut on one hand, air conditioned skyscraper on the other. Yeah, I'm going to go with the air conditioned skyscraper as evidence of the more advanced society.

Jeez, Rousseau really got to you people with that whole "noble savage" thing, didn't he?

There's a reason my ancestors gave up that whole way of life. The reason is it sucked.

and what exactly is it you have "advanced" to? To each his own, I'm all for freedom of choice. Some think it's more fun eating meat around the fire and being tired from hunting all day and telling stories about the hunt. Others get a thrill out of a limosine ride at 5 mph to a restaurant and then home to watch tv and setting an alarm clock.

pupu · Apr 21, 2012

Who went and got rid of slavery?

We need to bring that back and then you can do and call things by their proper name again.

The south shall rise again!!!!

logic_man · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from oldtime:

and what exactly is it you have "advanced" to? To each his own, I'm all for freedom of choice. Some think it's more fun eating meat around the fire and being tired from hunting all day and telling stories about the hunt. Others get a thrill out of a limosine ride at 5 mph to a restaurant and then home to watch tv and setting an alarm clock.

Yeah, everyone's a primitivist until he gets pneumonia and needs some antibiotics or his wife's uterus isn't up to the task and she needs fertility treatments.

Spare me the Iron John bullshit, please. It insults both of our intelligences.

oldtime · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from logic_man:

Yeah, everyone's a primitivist until he gets pneumonia and needs some antibiotics or his wife's uterus isn't up to the task and she needs fertility treatments.

Spare me the Iron John bullshit, please. It insults both of our intelligences.

I'll spare you the Iron John bullshit if you'll spare me the living in Manhattan is the pinnacle of success bullshit.

logic_man · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from oldtime:

I'll spare you the Iron John bullshit if you'll spare me the living in Manhattan is the pinnacle of success bullshit.

Dude, it isn't just me saying that, it's Old Blue Eyes. You gonna argue with Frank?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqlJl1LfDP4

Personally, I'm actually indifferent to Manhattan, but, yes, I do happen to live here. I went for a run in Central Park today, as a matter of fact. I can take it or leave it, though. It's just a place and, even when I walk around here, I find myself disgusted by the sheer amount of loserdom I see. Fat people, ugly people, disgustingly stupid people. But, yeah, it is pretty much true that if you "can make it there", you can "make it anywhere". That's just a brute fact.

oldtime · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from logic_man:

Dude, it isn't just me saying that, it's Old Blue Eyes. You gonna argue with Frank?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqlJl1LfDP4

Personally, I'm actually indifferent to Manhattan, but, yes, I do happen to live here. I went for a run in Central Park today, as a matter of fact. I can take it or leave it, though. It's just a place and, even when I walk around here, I find myself disgusted by the sheer amount of loserdom I see. Fat people, ugly people, disgustingly stupid people. But, yeah, it is pretty much true that if you "can make it there", you can "make it anywhere". That's just a brute fact.

ok, I'll let you off easy on this one. If you can make it against "fat people", "ugly people", and "disgustingly stupid people" (and Lord knows NYC has the best of the bunch) you should be able to "make it" anywhere.

Peoria would be a piece of cake.

Spike Trader · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from oldtime:

laugh if you want, but you're the one living in that jungle they call Manhattan. Somewhere there is a real man (not a city wimp) living in a grass hut with nothing on his to do list but to go hunting or fishing.

Oldtime. . . . will they imprison me when the US defaults on its loan obligations , even though i dont owe anyone any money ? If not , who will they imprison ?
Please take me fishing with you.

.

clacy · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from logic_man:

How would jail time be a disincentive to an entrepreneur who actually was bringing something of value to the market? It would only be a disincentive to the marginal (as I said in my original response) entrepreneur who was unlikely to succeed.

Those entrepreneurs would self-select against taking out loans, which would mean that banks would never have to even decide whether to give them a loan or not.

The fact that those marginal entrepreneurs, who ultimately fail, get loans now only confirms what economists have been saying for a long time about information asymmetries, i.e. the entrepreneurs likely know they are going to fail, but want to try anyway, and are able to put forth a convincing enough story to get the loan. If the entrepreneur knew that the penalty for exploiting this asymmetry was jail, they'd be less likely to indulge in it.

Sorry that the Econ 101 class you took didn't delve deep enough into these issues. Maybe next semester...

LOL. Clearly you have never run a business.

I have, and do currently (successfully I might add). Please show me a business that is such a no-brainer that you would risk jail time.

There aren't any, and anyone that has run a business knows there is often a VERY fine line between success and failure. If you want to restrict entrepreneurship to only those that are 100% lock guarantees, you would have virtually ZERO entrepreneurship.

I, along with some of our employees have literally hired around 100 employees in the last month because are will be expanding in May. I am confident that this expansion will be profitable, but you never know. One bad move can bring down an entire business. There are many things completely out of your control that can affect a business and cause failure. Weather for example.

I can assure you that if jail time were a consequence of failure, I would not have expanded, and thereby hired these folks.

Why don't you leave it up to my bank (small local, no bailouts) to figure out if they want to loan me money, and not weigh in on their decisions?

oldtime · Apr 21, 2012

Quote from Spiker:

Oldtime. . . . will they imprison me when the US defaults on its loan obligations , even though i dont owe anyone any money ? If not , who will they imprison ?
Please take me fishing with you..

well now you are talking futuristic Hollywood. Yes. When we can no longer pay our debts they start selling us to Foxconn to make Ipods. Then Mel Gibson gets pissed off and leads a rebellion. It is really class B. But eventually they redo it it with George Clooney and Angelina, and it is a big hit. (Angelina is George Clooney's daughter, just thought you should know, because it is not evident until you see the movie.)