Bernie is already blowing up the stock market.

[destriero]

UHC and others will absolutely lose half their mcap when Medicare for all relegates then to Medicare coinsurance. I've been posting that message for two years.

 

[Cuddles]

UHC and others will absolutely lose half their mcap when Medicare for all relegates then to Medicare coinsurance. I've been posting that message for two years.

My biotech portfolio bled for months on a potential Hilary shoe-in

 

[kingjelly]

I'm not sure where you get the tens of trillions number. But I'd argue that any medicare for all plan has to include a big stomp on the insurance and pharmaceutical companies, as the prices paid in this country are quite literally insane and unsustainable. Attack the prices, attack tort law, attack insurance, and raise corporate taxes somewhat for the benefit they will get for not having to provide health insurance (which is quite significant). This shelters corporations from increased costs of healthcare. Allow for private based insurance plans and allow doctors to have cash payment models allowing them to continue providing healthcare in private if they wish. Technology will still develop. There is the risk of rationing healthcare. That doesn't go away, but your insurance companies already do this when they deny claims regularly.

This will also have an indirect effect of raising salaries and hourly pay, as employees no longer look at jobs for their benefits, they'll look more for quality of life and pay.

I would agree to the wall, give up asylum laws, birthright, etc if we could just get this done.

 

[Tsing Tao]

You are in effect going to give everyone insurance whether they pay for it or not! Like Obamacare now, where a select few benefit from subsidies from others whose own premiums go thru the roof because the insurance companies jack up rates to cover those who might not pay up like illegals using emergency rooms, those being subsidized among other fees. There are no free lunches which is lost on a lot of people. Someone will end up paying for it and more than likely, it will be us! The only difference with Medicare for all is the government will run everything and you know with government running things, it becomes even more inefficient with more useless bureaucrats collecting 6 figure salaries on top of perks, it becomes more costly not save monies as those who believe in unicorns think! There will be less doctors working too. They will just retire than work for free when the Medicare reimbursements get cut year after year! Insurance companies will opt out because it will not make economic sense for them. The Federal government will own the hospitals and dole out care and ration it by force of necessity! Even that is not going to be enough! Look at the NHS of the UK as a preview of things to come! Then, after that, much like Cuba! Watch The UnAmerican movie on Amazon Prime to see what healthcare really is like in the UK and Cuba.

I understand (and agree) that the system pays for the care regardless of whether or not it is put under the government. However, by regulating the payments, you can at least control the insane inflation on it and inconsistent pricing a lot better as it is regulated. Right now, its the Wild West. You and I are paying for it with ridiculous rising medical costs when those who are uninsured are getting a free ride. At least, once regulated, the burden of cost is shared equally.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Retail says otherwise (sector I mentioned), which isn't even my point (showing the hypocrisy of crying foul over the immediate effect of some comment/tweet/news on healthcare, but not on tariffs):

Retail is being killed by Amazon and like companies, not tariffs.

 

[Cuddles]

Retail is being killed by Amazon and like companies, not tariffs.

Except retail was rallying along with Amazon pre-tariffs

 

[Tsing Tao]

Except retail was rallying along with Amazon pre-tariffs

Yeah, holy cow, look at that tariff effect.

Almost looks like the whole market was correlated or something. That's weird.

 

[Tsing Tao]

 

[smallfil]

I understand (and agree) that the system pays for the care regardless of whether or not it is put under the government. However, by regulating the payments, you can at least control the insane inflation on it and inconsistent pricing a lot better as it is regulated. Right now, its the Wild West. You and I are paying for it with ridiculous rising medical costs when those who are uninsured are getting a free ride. At least, once regulated, the burden of cost is shared equally.

The problem with government is you now add layers of bureaucrats making 6 or 7 figures doing little if anything and that is why the government running anything results in very huge deficits year after year! The way to control rising medical costs is more competition much like what happened to car insurance. When I started driving in 1992 in the US, I had to pay very high insurance premiums and deductibles being a new driver. Now, I pay much, much less because there are so many insurance companies now competing for car insurance. Do the same with these insurance companies providing healthcare and costs will go down! The reason it is so expensive with Obamacare now in place is they favored a few insurance companies without any real competition! Unions got into it figuring, they can collect union dues to pay for their officials huge salaries and perks by unionizing all the support people working for hospitals to boot! Add to that the subsidies majority of us are paying so that, a select few get subsidies and pay cheap health insurance while, the rest of us pay sky high premiums and deductibles!

 

[Tsing Tao]

The problem with government is you now add layers of bureaucrats making 6 or 7 figures doing little if anything and that is why the government running anything results in very huge deficits year after year! The way to control rising medical costs is more competition much like what happened to car insurance. When I started driving in 1992 in the US, I had to pay very high insurance premiums and deductibles being a new driver. Now, I pay much, much less because there are so many insurance companies now competing for car insurance. Do the same with these insurance companies providing healthcare and costs will go down! The reason it is so expensive with Obamacare now in place is they favored a few insurance companies without any real competition! Unions got into it figuring, they can collect union dues to pay for their officials huge salaries and perks by unionizing all the support people working for hospitals to boot! Add to that the subsidies majority of us are paying so that, a select few get subsidies and pay cheap health insurance while, the rest of us pay sky high premiums and deductibles!

You add the layers of bureaucrats regardless of whether it is at the government level or the private insurance company level. Competition helps, but in the medical insurance industry the cabal of a few large corporations is very difficult to break in the free market. The risk profile cannot be compared to car insurance, it is much, much higher in frequency and at the cost of claim level. Small companies cannot become health insurance providers. All they can do is resell the policy and pony off the risk.