America DEBT FREE in 2 years

[achilles28]

Quote from trefoil:

Care to refute, with something more than one-sentence drive-bys?

It was a cursory comment made with little regard for the macro outlook.

Empires don't turn and fall on a dime.

Their demise is gradual and protracted.

Pointing to a 'best cities' ranking is like using todays paper to forecast 20 years into the future.

Irrelevant.

 

[trefoil]

achilles: Actually, that's the exact point I was trying to make.
So why all these overheated posts about the US crashing & burning soon?

 

[achilles28]

Quote from rcanfiel:


Manufacturing pays little better than Walmart jobs, frankly.

The average auto-parts worker makes far more than any Walmart greeter or burger flipper.

Exporting the middle class only erodes the wage base necessary to support it.

The more jobs exported, the more Americans are forced to buy Chinese - its all they can afford.

Race to the bottom.

Quote from rcanfiel:

Our problem is DEBT.

Debt and the dearth of a middle class.

Amongst other things, wealth affords the time and resources needed to hold mis-managers to account.

Jefferson spoke at length about this.

How is the average citizen supposed to "get involved" carrying 2 jobs to support the family and mortgage payments?

 

[rcanfiel]

Quote from achilles28:

The average auto-parts worker makes far more than any Walmart greeter or burger flipper.

Exporting the middle class only erodes the wage base necessary to support it.

The more jobs exported, the more Americans are forced to buy Chinese - its all they can afford.

Race to the bottom.





Debt and the dearth of a middle class.

Amongst other things, wealth affords the time and resources needed to hold mis-managers to account.

Jefferson spoke at length about this.

How is the average citizen supposed to "get involved" carrying 2 jobs to support the family and mortgage payments?

Evidence, rather than statements, please? The economy is strong, employment is full, and on average, people are better off than their parents.

 

[rcanfiel]

Quote from achilles28:

Wrong.

Manufacturing serves as the epicenter of a nations innovative process.

Where goes manufacturing, so goes R&D and process refinement. This is true for most industries.

'Disposable' factory jobs serve as a bullwark against severe recessions or depressions.

Try recycling money domestically when every dollar spent goes overseas.

Chinas pollution has nothing to do with it.

Great, then I am sure you wouldn't mind providing some hard proof. The country has jobs for everyone. Re: manufacturing, Automation is continuously driving away the job base, without the help of China. In 10-15 years, there may be little need for factory workers. Try the Science Channel show, "How its Made." Most of the work is done automatically. Manufacturing jobs are only on a downward spiral, not the heart of the 21st center nation's future.

 

[watchdaride]

Quote from rcanfiel:

Evidence, rather than statements, please? The economy is strong, employment is full, and on average, people are better off than their parents.

why are we better off than our parents because we buy a new car every 3 years and take vacation all over the world. Its all done on credit . Now you need 2 parents working with more debt than assets . people pay there whole pay checks for the mortage and credit cards. It will be interesting to see how people will do if there is a work slowdown . They are loosing there houses and bankruptcy is high with full employment now.

I went to shopping today for some electronics and all 3 stores begged me to apply for there credit cards . no interest no payment for 12 months. I kept telling them i had the cash but they couldnt understand why i wouldnt use there credit. I guess i am old school . No debt= freedom

 

[TorontoTrader2]

Quote from dalailama:

1: Pay of debt with debt free US notes issued by the government

2: Abolish fractional reserve lending.. as the debt is paid off raise the reserve requirements of banks to absorb the new money and maintain stability

3: Repeal the Federal Reserve Act and the National Banking Act

4: Withdraw from the IMF, BIS and World Bank

FUNNY GUY YOU ARE!!

The last two presidents who attempted similar were asassinated.

Learn from history...

Israel depends on the USA for "aid" (aka bribes to prevent the mossad from doing its dirty work - just google seach for: USS Liberty - to see what I mean) and is not about to cut off its sugar daddy. bush just gave another 30 billion of your hard earned tax money to them.

I dare ya, try to stand up to them!

 

[rcanfiel]

Quote from watchdaride:

why are we better off than our parents because we buy a new car every 3 years and take vacation all over the world.

Our homes are much bigger, we have more cars, we travel more, our kids fill their summers with weeklong camps. Long-distance and international flights are much more affordable. Buying the basics is much cheaper due to internationalization. People now have computers, bigscreen TVs, a host of devices, much better medical technology. Cancer used to be a death sentence, now many survive. The list goes on...

Its all done on credit . They have to pay the credit off, just like 30 years ago. Now you need 2 parents working with more debt than assets .

In the 50s and 60s, blacks and women were not even really allowed to get real jobs, only white males. Now they have much more mobility and freedom.

people pay there whole pay checks for the mortage and credit cards.

And they didn't have credit 30 years ago?

It will be interesting to see how people will do if there is a work slowdown. They are loosing there houses and bankruptcy is high with full employment now.

Same as any past recession. Remember the Great Depression?

 

[Haroki]

Quote from DrEvil:

[B
don't pay income tax (if you are willing to go to court as has been seen with Ed Brown and others, they won't be able to find a law that says you have to or should pay it).

[/B]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA....

He escaped a prison term.

He'll still have to pay up. Plus attorney fees. Plus court costs. Plus interest. Plus fines....

 

[Razor]

Hi,

IMHO people in the first world like USA, UK, Europe etc have slowly (through TV, inet, etc) decided that everyone should have everything they want NOW......well the reality is just like it has been since the beginning of time there will have to be poor people, better than poor.....middle class....rich, filthy rich etc etc......but people are not willing to accept that anymore, instead of some people saying ok, I will have to get up work a 10 hour day 5 - 6 days per week and be happy with my little house, small TV, economy car, vacation maybe once a year with family etc, EVERYONE now expects to have a huge house, fancy car, flat screens, latest cell phones etc, etc.....and how do they get it, credit cards or debt if you will.......the reality is everyone can't have everything, some people will have to earn the low incomes, some earn higher, and then higher again etc....but problem is because of media people all want to have the latest and greatest...it just can't be, IMHO it's a zero sum game...in order for certain people to be rich others will have to be poor but the problem is no one wants to be the middle class anymore and the debt is going to essentially ruin them where we end up with no middle class and just very poor people and the rich and ultra rich.....it's a shame but it will probably take a massive recession for people to start realizing that maybe happiness is not the latest cell phone but rather having enough money to put a roof over your families head and to provide enough food so they can all sit around the table together and enjoy dinner (instead of all huddled around the TV not saying a word...)......yes we should all shoot for the stars but trying to get there through debt is just dumb.....one day people will go back to reality where their salary is broken down like back in the old days.....no debt period except a small mortgage (maybe 10 - 20% of ones monthly salary), no car payments and zero credit card debt and guess what 20 - 25% being SAVED per month....it will probably take a huge depression for this reality to set back in IMHO.....

Cheers