Al Brooks, I apologize..

[taowave]

And where's your proof that you trade? You've been at this for nine years. Surely there's something.

Do I care? Not in the least. So why should you?

We are discussing 2 different things..my initial post was

"Disagree with those who think someone should not post their P&L,when making claims to a method that has turned their trading around. Yes,the need for tangible proof may be requested by those still seeking,or it may be by those who know the proof is in the pudding.
IMHO,posting outstanding verifiable trading results has massive upside with zero downside."

And Forty offered

"They just keep raising their hands."

Thats what I was addressing...

And in the name of full disclosure,I trade a very limited portion of my capital.Its meaningless,more for shits and giggles..
I was managing director of equity derivatives at 2 Investment banks,and "left" Wall Street in 2002. IMO,gathering/managing assets is a far better way to go than slugging it out trading.FYI, I find real estate to be a far better business,as there is actual edge,something tangible.

 

[dbphoenix]

We are discussing 2 different things..my initial post was

"Disagree with those who think someone should not post their P&L,when making claims to a method that has turned their trading around. Yes,the need for tangible proof may be requested by those still seeking,or it may be by those who know the proof is in the pudding.
IMHO,posting outstanding verifiable trading results has massive upside with zero downside."

And Forty offered

"They just keep raising their hands."

Thats what I was addressing...

And in the name of full disclosure,I trade a very limited portion of my capital.Its meaningless,more for shits and giggles..
I was managing director of equity derivatives at 2 Investment banks,and "left" Wall Street in 2002. IMO,gathering/managing assets is a far better way to go than slugging it out trading.FYI, I find real estate to be a far better business,as there is actual edge,something tangible.

And yet you can offer proof of none of this. Wouldn't it be nice though if the response were to be good for you rather than demands for your tax returns? Discussion might actually lead somewhere and be of benefit instead of coming to a screeching halt and detour into charge and counter-charge.

 

[Laissez Faire]

It sucks if someone took advantage of you here.

No big deal and I wouldn't say he took advantage of me, but if I could prevent others from being as naive as I was it would make me happy.

I just don't see why people can't be open about their P&L, unless they have something to hide? You don't even have to post a P&L. Just tell me flat out. Perhaps I'll even believe you. Tell me you had your biggest losing month just recently. It happens.

There was a guy on this forum, I forgot his handle, who actually produced proof of his P&L (he posted his yearly statements). I don't think he was making substantial amounts of money, but he had a nice return on his capital. Day trading. The last time I read anything from him he said he had lost his edge and that the markets had changed (apparently not being able to adapt).

Another guy that comes to mind is Neke. I don't recall his complete history, but I think he made a substantial amount of money, but then later on had a huge losing streak where he honestly posted his P&L statements losing week after losing week.

So, whenever I hear people on this forum who claim that it's extremely rare that they have losing days and give the impression that they're some infallible guru who never loses and that trading is even easy and just 'just have to put in the work' I get suspicious, because I have enough experience and knowledge to know that consistent profits from trading an ever changing market is NOT easy.

 

[dbphoenix]

So, whenever I hear people on this forum who claim that it's extremely rare that they have losing days and give the impression that they're some infallible guru who never loses and that trading is even easy and just 'just have to put in the work' I get suspicious, because I have enough experience and knowledge to know that consistent profits from trading an ever changing market is NOT easy.

Not suspicious enough to actually read the material.

Which brings us full circle: the posted "P&L" is irrelevant; what matters is the trading plan. And how many people have a thoroughly-tested and consistently-profitable trading plan? I know of only two, maybe three. If people ask for your advice without having seen yours, they are pretty much in the same position you were. The fact that you're giving it away doesn't mean that there's no cost to the people following that advice.

 

[fortydraws]

I was managing director of equity derivatives at 2 Investment banks,and "left" Wall Street in 2002. IMO,gathering/managing assets is a far better way to go than slugging it out trading.FYI, I find real estate to be a far better business,as there is actual edge,something tangible.

So let's see, we need resumés, letters of separation, deeds to your properties of course ...

I have no reason to believe you. But I have no reason not to believe you. Its the internet. If you were to start a thread describing how you traded in real estate, only a crank would ask you for deeds, tax returns, evidence of any 1031 exchanges, etc. and so on. I'd take you at your word, and do my own due diligence on your particular approach to re investment before undertaking the same course for myself.

 

[wrbtrader]

...IMHO, posting outstanding verifiable trading results has massive upside with zero downside."...

How does this benefit MarketAddict considering he never implied nor stated he had outstanding trading results ?

I'm not debating here, I'm just curious what that massive upside with zero downside would mean to him. For example, will he get a date with a hot sexy model girl ? Seriously, what exactly is meant by your statement.

 

[dbphoenix]

In the meantime, no doubt MarketAddict wishes he'd never said anything at all, and is less likely to do so again, which is the end result of this sort of kneejerk response to any hint that someone might enjoy even a modicum of success.

And the members wonder where everybody has gone . . .

 

[taowave]

And yet you can offer proof of none of this. Wouldn't it be nice though if the response were to be good for you rather than demands for your tax returns? Discussion might actually lead somewhere and be of benefit instead of coming to a screeching halt and detour into charge and counter-charge.

And yet you can offer proof of none of this. Wouldn't it be nice though if the response were to be good for you rather than demands for your tax returns? Discussion might actually lead somewhere and be of benefit instead of coming to a screeching halt and detour into charge and counter-charge.

Yes,the need for tangible proof may be requested by those still seeking,or it may be by those who know the proof is in the pudding."

DB,to quote a fellow poster,"the wheels fell off the bus" by page 2.
I joined in on page 4. Both sides were not terribly respectful.

How does this benefit MarketAddict considering he never implied nor stated he had outstanding trading results ?

I'm not debating here, I'm just curious what that massive upside with zero downside would mean to him. For example, will he get a date with a hot sexy model girl ? Seriously, what exactly is meant by your statement.

I was honestly not debating either,nor was I specifically addressing the OP.I joined in the conversation late,and agreed there are those still seeking,AND/OR those who want proof of profitability. Its not necessarily one or the other.

My point is,if anyone should make a claim on profitability,and can actually verify them,they could very well have someone knocking on their door offering them 1 and 20,2 and 20 or a higher split dependent on their style of trading.To post profitable results can only lead to good things,with no real downside.

I have traded firm capital,hedge fund money and my own,and I would choose OPM 11 out of 10 times.

 

[candles]

Is the issue that the detractors think that Anyone can draw a range in foresight, and then use the benefit of hindsight to annotate a chart on how they traded that range?

 

[Brianharvey]

I've never read the book, but I've seen a few Al brooks videos that were kind of interesting.