Advice on buying some Pistols

Quote from Eight:

oh yeah, take away all those guns and people will be better off... a quick look at cultures that disarm shows that the next step is often a complete takeover of government and people being hauled out of their houses and never heard from again... and don't forget to factor in all the crime that is deterred by gun owners..

People are capable of being so convinced of the correctness of their stance when their reasoning is childish.. Our Medical industry sees a connection between cholesterol and heart disease so they sell billions of dollars worth of drugs that lower cholesterol.. but the actual fact is that those drugs don't lower heart disease!! People see that somebody got hurt by a gun so they jump to the conclusion that less guns is better, whereas it's shown many times and many ways that more guns is better and training people to use them correctly and be less violent people is better.

The murder rate is not tremendously different in countries like Britain where guns are outlawed compared to the US, somewhat but not tremendously...

Personally I like Teddy Roosevelt's idea, ability to handle various firearms was part of his physical fitness recommendation to the nation.
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Eight,

I'd be happy to believe your argument if it was actually true. The facts suggest otherwise.

"The level of gun ownership world-wide is directly related to murder and suicide rates and specifically to the level of death by gunfire."

International Correlation between gun ownership and rates of homicide and suicide.' Professor Martin Killias, May 1993.



Gun Deaths - International Comparisons
Gun deaths per 100,000 population (for the year indicated):

Homicide Suicide Other (inc Accident)

USA (2001) 3.98 5.92 0.36
Italy (1997) 0.81 1.1 0.07
Switzerland (1998) 0.50 5.8 0.10
Canada (2002) 0.4 2.0 0.04
Finland (2003) 0.35 4.45 0.10
Australia (2001) 0.24 1.34 0.10
France (2001) 0.21 3.4 0.49
England/Wales (2002) 0.15 0.2 0.03
Scotland (2002) 0.06 0.2 0.02
Japan (2002) 0.02 0.04 0
Data taken from Cukier and Sidel (2006) The Global Gun Epidemic. Praeger Security International. Westport.
 
Quote from Runningbear:

Eight,

I'd be happy to believe your argument if it was actually true. The facts suggest otherwise.

"The level of gun ownership world-wide is directly related to murder and suicide rates and specifically to the level of death by gunfire."

International Correlation between gun ownership and rates of homicide and suicide.' Professor Martin Killias, May 1993.



Gun Deaths - International Comparisons
Gun deaths per 100,000 population (for the year indicated):

Homicide Suicide Other (inc Accident)

USA (2001) 3.98 5.92 0.36

Switzerland (1998) 0.50 5.8 0.10

Data taken from Cukier and Sidel (2006) The Global Gun Epidemic. Praeger Security International. Westport.
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Switzerland has more automatic weapons per capita than any other civilized country including the US, yet their murder by gun number is much lower.
Why do you think is that ?
 
Quote from Runningbear:

Gun Deaths - International Comparisons
Gun deaths per 100,000 population (for the year indicated):

Homicide Suicide Other (inc Accident)

USA (2001) 3.98 5.92 0.36
Italy (1997) 0.81 1.1 0.07
Switzerland (1998) 0.50 5.8 0.10
Canada (2002) 0.4 2.0 0.04
Finland (2003) 0.35 4.45 0.10
Australia (2001) 0.24 1.34 0.10
France (2001) 0.21 3.4 0.49
England/Wales (2002) 0.15 0.2 0.03
Scotland (2002) 0.06 0.2 0.02
Japan (2002) 0.02 0.04 0
Data taken from Cukier and Sidel (2006) The Global Gun Epidemic. Praeger Security International. Westport.
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So countries with very strict guns laws or even complete gun bans still have gun related homicides?

What about the poor dumb bastards being murdered with guns the murderers are not supposed to have? Aren't they still just as dead as they would be here in the states? Would not at least some of them survive if their government would let them arm and defend themselves?
 
It is just so hard to make comparisons. For example, how many of those low rated countries have the drug gangs and cartels we deal with in the USA. How many of those deaths were due to law enforcement? Bottom line still is that the bad guys will not turn in their guns. And I also know that when/if civil unrest hits, my pacifist friends will be asking if I have a spare shotgun, after they see a few neighbors robbed and murdered.
 
Quote from Eight:

I've been reading up on psychopaths recently. They are not reasonable people at all. I'm finding that they can be swayed by acts of kindness though. Nonetheless when one comes through my bedroom window I'm going to probably incapacitate him physically any way I can.

I have found from past experience that a loose item or piece of furniture that is in my hand is far better than a pistol that is in the next room. I fought back a guy that was huge, [I'm 6' and this guy towered over me] by grabbing a screwdriver and sticking it in his belly and making him go backwards until he fell over something... Quick thinking and the quickest weapon is just great and it has a far better outcome than shooting somebody. He and I were friends after that, had I shot him we'd never be friends...

I'm far more of a pepper spray advocate than a gun advocate. I'd never advocate against gun ownership though. The reality is that an armed population is very hard to take on by enemies domestic or foreign. Japan rejected the idea of invading the US of A from the west because of the armed populace and that freed up our armies to take on Hitler.
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a quick open hand to the adams apple will stop anyone for 3 or 4 minutes as they are trying to get their breath back,teach that to your daughters,wives
 
Quote from ammo:

a quick open hand to the adams apple will stop anyone for 3 or 4 minutes as they are trying to get their breath back,teach that to your daughters,wives
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Finger jab to the eyes. Extremely fast and near impossible to defend against at close range. Then you can play with the blind in a thousand ways or flee.

'Not being there' to be attacked is better, of course.
 
Quote from bmwhendrix:

It is just so hard to make comparisons. For example, how many of those low rated countries have the drug gangs and cartels we deal with in the USA. How many of those deaths were due to law enforcement? Bottom line still is that the bad guys will not turn in their guns. And I also know that when/if civil unrest hits, my pacifist friends will be asking if I have a spare shotgun, after they see a few neighbors robbed and murdered.
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And you will gladly lend a trusted neighboor your gun if that happens.
 
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