A must watch video, Obama's radical tax plan...

Quote from runningman:

Bush's plan of tax cuts is definitely better. The market sure has surged since he got in-- did you know since the MBA President started, the market is up about 4%? Not 4% per year, 4%. Compare that to the tripling under Clinton. Raising taxes does not necessarily hurt the market.
Maybe those making more than $250k will start crying for the war to be over so their tax dollars are not wasted in Iraq.
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Yup ! Couldn't have said it better myself. Bush has been running wild and not running the business. You barely hear the fact that the national debt will have gone up almost 40 % under his watch. It's time to pull in the reigns and to run the business as it should. And yes, some of us will have to pay for the mistakes of George Bush - probably the worst President in the last 40+ years (and that includes Carter).

And to further expand, I am not saying that Rich people should pay the entire cost. Right now, as we speak, the middle class is getting shitted all over....they are the real losers in this. They pay their taxes to support the poor and the rich (who escape taxation). Regardless of where you sit on this matter, there is no denying that Bush has run the economy into the ground, and has failed every which way:

- Unjustified War and its horrible death toll
- Unjustified War and its horrible cost
- Horrible Trade imbalance
- Fleeing of jobs overseas
- Runaway budget deficit and national debt
- Blind eye towards the mortgage industry's improper practices
- Blind eye towards the healthcare industry's runaway train
- Blind eye to surging price of oil and pushing any real alternatives
- Imposition of Imperialistic (his) ideals on rest of world
- Ignoring the rules imposed by WTO
- Horrible Immigration policy

Are you really gonna sit there and selfishly say that the preservation of capital gains and dividend taxes outweighs all of these other failures ? McCain is certainly more moderate, but if he gets in, it's a continuation of spending on this senseless war, and economically (forget about the more important issue of loss of human life) our kids and grandchildren will suffer the consequences of this for generations to come.

Clinton may have been an asshole in how he let his personal life dictate his legacy, but he knew how to run a business, and let's not forget how our 401K's soared during his tenure. Like him or not, we all done good back in the day...........
 
Quote from hayman:

Yup ! Couldn't have said it better myself. Bush has been running wild and not running the business. You barely hear the fact that the national debt will have gone up almost 40 % under his watch. It's time to pull in the reigns and to run the business as it should. And yes, some of us will have to pay for the mistakes of George Bush - probably the worst President in the last 40+ years (and that includes Carter).
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Agree with all you've said except for agreeing with OPs lauding Clinton. He was a dickweed president also, just financial circumstances smiled upon his reign... that, and he raised taxes.
 
Quote from gnome:

Agree with all you've said except for agreeing with OPs lauding Clinton. He was a dickweed president also, just financial circumstances smiled upon his reign... that, and he raised taxes.
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Gnome, everything is relative. See my amended post before yours. Right now, the dickweed President is looking pretty darn good.....
 
Quote from hayman:

Gnome, everything is relative. See my amended post before yours. Right now, the dickweed President is looking pretty darn good.....
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He's not looking good in my eyes. For you to think so, you have to be narrow minded and biased, not objectively analytical.
 
Quote from gnome:

I have LOTS to fear from politicians distributing MY wealth. I EARNED IT... they're not entitled to confiscate and redistribute my efforts to win election.

There are MILLIONS more of Americans who could have become rich had they made the effort... it's never been a requirement to be born with a silver spoon.

You want to be rich like somebody you know? Then get out of your seat and do something that if successful could make you rich. No American has ever been "entitled" to more than the opportunity.
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hardly anyone will become rich by working his ass off, to be wealthy you mostly have to start off wealthy

'No American has ever been "entitled" to more than the opportunity.'
if by opportunity you mean the family they grew in, you are right

for reasons stated above, i hate most poor people, and more than that i hate all poor countries, i do not believe in sharing with poor people, i am not happy to give my money to them in anyway

most poor people are stupid, no too stupid to be accepted as human, they do not know how to talk properly or even walk properly, they do not care to think, and if they are given wealth or power, not only they will not be thankful of it, but they will make your life harder just because now they are what they never were

last but not least most poor people know nothing about respect, they don't understand it in anyway, the only way they will respect you is by keeping them poor
 
Quote from thesharpone:

hardly anyone will become rich by working his ass off, to be wealthy you mostly have to start off wealthy...
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I'm calling BULLSHIT on you! The MANY modestly rich people I know made their own. And I was about one notch above homeless at one time. I even joined the military just so I could eat regular.

Don't tell me about "starting off wealthy is the only way"...
 
Quote from gnome: And when it comes to social support, I like what the Mormons do. (Not one myself, just worked in an office full of them years ago.) That is... if you need financial help, they will help you pay your bills and feed your family. In exchange, you will continue to look for employment and also help the church out as best you can... like paint a house, or mow lawns, or whatever needs done. If you are able but refuse to lend a hand, then you don't receive financial aid. Makes a lot of sense to me.
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Exactly. It would do the world much more good if individuals or families helped individuals and families. That promotes accountability upon the recipient to do well, whereas anonymous handouts accomplish nothing but dependence. There is much less efficiency with the government with much greater power over the people.

Giving, helping others directly, measured and proven scientifically, boosts the immune system, health and just feels good, whereas having your earnings unwillingly seized breeds resentment that results in less productivity, less wealth creation FOR ALL, fewer jobs-why would a business owner want to expand and take on more risk and work for less money. Why not look for creative tax shelters, why not cheat on taxes, and move your wealth overseas.

You never hear of wealth creation, only wealth redistribution. Never hear of a politician saying 'I will help you help yourself'. Always 'here is your handout, you don't have to do anything, except vote for me'.

Look at all the enormous wealth created in the US compared to just across the border in Mexico. I guess the taxinators are striving for Mexican wealth equality.


I began to understand 20+ years ago that it was not making sense to tax productivity no matter what I heard in the media. I bloody saw it in my bloody paycheck. The harder I worked, the more the government took from me. I did not want to work overtime, I did not want to increase production bonuses.

The poorest have it so good here. I never made much when I was working, and I am by far living so far below the poverty level for years it would kill today's typical whiner. Yet I have it so good here, it would not be possible in most other countries. How could such selfish people want even more from the government?

I am not receiving a dime from the government, although I am disabled, getting better- I worked to get better. I also prepared myself for this day when I would come upon hard times. Hard times for not much longer as I actually have a bit of ambition. I hope I don't get taxed to the death for it. That would be incentive to go on welfare, disability.


Quote from gnome: How long do you think I'd last? (Shoot, how long do you think I'd LIVE?)
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No, you wouldn't stand a chance, but I gots me wishes too.
 
Quote from hayman:

".. Clinton may have been an asshole in how he let his personal life dictate his legacy, but he knew how to run a business, and let's not forget how our 401K's soared during his tenure. Like him or not, we all done good back in the day...........
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You obviously don't understand the difference between "cause" and "good fortune".
 
Quote from thesharpone:


for reasons stated above, i hate most poor people, and more than that i hate all poor countries, i do not believe in sharing with poor people, i am not happy to give my money to them in anyway

most poor people are stupid, no too stupid to be accepted as human, they do not know how to talk properly or even walk properly, they do not care to think, and if they are given wealth or power, not only they will not be thankful of it, but they will make your life harder just because now they are what they never were

last but not least most poor people know nothing about respect, they don't understand it in anyway, the only way they will respect you is by keeping them poor
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They are only human and doing exactly what we would do if put in their situation. (I believe this was Lincoln)

You know when I visit the poorest areas of a poor country, these are the nicest most genuine and hospitable people you could imagine. The key is they have to be poor and isolated, not seeing wealth around them. When you have poor people who see wealth around them, they are completely different. Greed kicks in and they want what they see others having. Humanity is humanity.
 
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