A Kinetic Energy Idea

well, i identify swing in a pretty discretionary way. I guess my eye has come to take into account volatility as well as price action when telling me when there is a good swing or a confusing one.

but for me it's simple, a bullish swing is price action between where supply depleted (the low) and where demand was depleted and supply took over again (the high). i don't take it too mechanically.

when i trade say long, i am looking for a good bullish swing that would show me that demand (bulls) is getting stronger while previous supply failed (basically a higher-high, higher-low pattern) but with increased strength from demand cycle to demand cycle. that's how i know the market is optimistic and not just tested the high, went above it (by manipulation) establishing a slightly higher high and then coming back.

the swing that i buy the retracement after should be larger than the preceding swing. that's how i know demand is good and people are buying out of conviction.

furthermore, the pullback has to be swift because the more it hangs there at the top, and not retracing, is a sign the people are starting to see the swing high more as a top than a temporary pause.

there is a message before the trade in what concerns supply and demand and then you gotta pay attention to the message after the trade, again by looking at supply and demand. keeping objective, yet, not mechanical is the most pleasant, comfortable and humanly way possbile.

the next thing you know, you start trading out of pure intuition (after some years) and what do you know... your trades are generally good.

and while you're not looking at a speedometer, just by looking at how fast the landscape moves you know if you are breaking the law or not. furthermore, you have time to look at other cars, people crossing the street, policemen etc (a metaphor for taking care of money management and trade management and overall account management and not worrying too much about technicals).

we have ONE mind that has to take care of everything.... y'know!
 
Building an indicator is just to sort out (pop up) which tape (stock) to listen since there are so many. And then you are on your own way to listen that tape (its price). Computer can't listen accurately than you. The computer (indicator) is Google Search but after that you is the one who must pick the right document.
 
exactly

ATR has been generally regarded as an overall measure of volatility even back in the day.

If ATR is above it's 50% historical threshold then you are in a high volatility season and it's worth trading at higher speeds (lower timeframes) and reverse for low volatility periods...

there a few other indicators out there that also are good.

there are even indicators that are useful not because of their value, but because of the esthetical aspect. i consider bollinger bands as being beautiful looking and they help relax my eye... i am not kidding. when the price bars are spread out all across the screen from top to bottom they seem to get very very large and scary, however, when you apply bollinger bands, because they get wider when things get more volatile, the chart autocompresses and you get practically the same bars but not that large.... :)
 
Quote from alex.samant:


there are even indicators that are useful not because of their value, but because of the esthetical aspect. i consider bollinger bands as being beautiful looking and they help relax my eye... i am not kidding. when the price bars are spread out all across the screen from top to bottom they seem to get very very large and scary, however, when you apply bollinger bands, because they get wider when things get more volatile, the chart autocompresses and you get practically the same bars but not that large.... :)

I like this. Esthetics is a philological enhancer! Absolutely! How about this indicator? I called it "Elastic Bands". Is it esthetically pleasing?
 

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Quote from alex.samant:

i use charts and i don't think a chart is an indicator (and i wouldn't want to go into semantics).

a chart with only price shows the history of price over a period of time. that's it.

it's the most basic level of visualizing where price action was right up to the present moment.

an indicator (or study), as accepted by the trading community is the interpretation of price action using a certain formula. it's a "translation" of price action.

the main idea here is that YOU DON'T NEED A TRANSLATION.

YOU NEED TO SPEAK THE LANGUAGE OF PRICE ACTION.

just as true as in all languages.

However a chart is limited. It shows only 2 dimensions: price and time. If the market operates in more than 2 dimensions you can't see it as you are only mapping 2 dimensions.

There is a great book called "Flatland" which explores the difficulty of looking at something with fewer dimensions than actually exist. It's a bit like an ant crawling along a large water pipe. From the perspective of the ant the pipe appears flat. If it happens to crawl around the circumference it returns to where it was and is mystified how that would be possible on a apparently flat surface.
 
Quote from eagle:

Building an indicator is just to sort out (pop up) which tape (stock) to listen since there are so many. And then you are on your own way to listen that tape (its price). Computer can't listen accurately than you. The computer (indicator) is Google Search but after that you is the one who must pick the right document.

Not really true. If you convert what you use to trade to code your computer can find what to trade, trade it and text message you the results, while you enjoy the beach.

It can also monitor and trade global markets 24 hours a day. It’s a lot like what the industrial revolution did for the production of goods. 300 years ago everything was made by hand, that old handcrafted concept. Now machines can product what 100 skilled craftsmen used to produce, with few sick days and defects.
 
Quote from MAESTRO:

I like this. Esthetics is a philological enhancer! Absolutely! How about this indicator? I called it "Elastic Bands". Is it esthetically pleasing?

no. waay to busy.
 
I missed getting in on this mornings conversation so heres my .02 .

Point 1:
I watch charts and i read the ticker tape.
I watch charts for support, resistance, volume and direction.

I read the ticker tape to find out what the stock is "doing." I cant really explain it better than that. I equate it to driving a car and being able to stay in between the lanes. Its less Brain and more Mind.

Point 2:
In computer science most applications can be boiled down into two camps: Programs and Scripts.

Programs typically consist of libraries and an executable and it has a wide variety of purposes within a single framework. Think MS Excel. Its purpose is to "do stuff with numbers." Whereas MS Word is "do stuff with words"

Scripts are just the opposite. They are compiled at runtime (i.e. not a pre-compiled executable) and typically serve a specific purpose such as changing file properties throughout multiple subdirectories on files beginning with 'n'...etc.

There is a saying in CS that goes: "Scripts are for the actors and Programs are for the audience."

Tyeing it all together:

(For me) Charts are a lagging indicator that act as the pivot point between technical indicators (like macd and stochastics) and the ticker tape.

In other words Scripts are the ticker tape and everything else is a program.
Furthermore, that is why you dont see any charts in trading pits (other than base terminals by the phones) because in order to make a market efficiently you have to be "in the now" and not looking at a chart for confirmation. Granted they go into the pits with mental pivot points, but that is a precalculated point of reference.

You might ask "then why use charts at all?" And the answer is dissemination of information. If you can read a chart better than you can watch the ticker tape that is what you are going to do. So if you are then driving the market based off of some graphed indicator that you and a few thousand other traders are using then the market maker is going to see that action and move accordingly. If it works it works and if is doesn't it doesn't...someone made money and someone lost money ...the balance sheet goes to 0.

I have more and could go on but i might get hershey on you (if i havent already)



:D
 
Quote from gehko:

I missed getting in on this mornings conversation so heres my .02 .

Point 1:
I watch charts and i read the ticker tape.
I watch charts for support, resistance, volume and direction.

I read the ticker tape to find out what the stock is "doing." I cant really explain it better than that. I equate it to driving a car and being able to stay in between the lanes. Its less Brain and more Mind.

Point 2:
In computer science most applications can be boiled down into two camps: Programs and Scripts.

Programs typically consist of libraries and an executable and it has a wide variety of purposes within a single framework. Think MS Excel. Its purpose is to "do stuff with numbers." Whereas MS Word is "do stuff with words"

Scripts are just the opposite. They are compiled at runtime (i.e. not a pre-compiled executable) and typically serve a specific purpose such as changing file properties throughout multiple subdirectories on files beginning with 'n'...etc.

There is a saying in CS that goes: "Scripts are for the actors and Programs are for the audience."

Tyeing it all together:

(For me) Charts are a lagging indicator that act as the pivot point between technical indicators (like macd and stochastics) and the ticker tape.

In other words Scripts are the ticker tape and everything else is a program.
Furthermore, that is why you dont see any charts in trading pits (other than base terminals by the phones) because in order to make a market efficiently you have to be "in the now" and not looking at a chart for confirmation. Granted they go into the pits with mental pivot points, but that is a precalculated point of reference.

You might ask "then why use charts at all?" And the answer is dissemination of information. If you can read a chart better than you can watch the ticker tape that is what you are going to do. So if you are then driving the market based off of some graphed indicator that you and a few thousand other traders are using then the market maker is going to see that action and move accordingly. If it works it works and if is doesn't it doesn't...someone made money and someone lost money ...the balance sheet goes to 0.

I have more and could go on but i might get hershey on you (if i havent already)



:D

You missed soft computing in your survey of IT and trading.

Also in Futres at least pit trading is almost dead. It's electronic now.
 
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